Don't be a D..K

[MVEED3]

I hope we are unaffected by the outcome of this case:

https://www.revzilla.com/common-trea...nd-club-racing

[roastbeef]

I hope he gets stuck with lawyer's fees. What a douche.

[dparm]

Damn, that situation sucks. I guess I'm confused by the sandbags as well, but I don't really know the course or motorcycles in general.

I guess I'll be paying attention to the outcome, though I think it's a bit sensationalist to say it could be the start of the end for enthusiast HPDEs or whatever.

[scotty_miller]

That is stupid. If you are in this hobby whether it's bikes or cars you should know if you crash there is an inevitable outcome bones or parts are getting broken depending on the severity. It's part of the hobby and plus these hobbies are expensive so pay to play even if it means a snapped femur. People like this ruin the sport. Man up or take up something less dangerous like golf

[are0lies]

Originally Posted by scotty_miller

That is stupid. If you are in this hobby whether it's bikes or cars you should know if you crash there is an inevitable outcome bones or parts are getting broken depending on the severity. It's part of the hobby and plus these hobbies are expensive so pay to play even if it means a snapped femur. People like this ruin the sport. Man up or take up something less dangerous like golf

You're in for it now. Do you know how many people are hurt, due to the sport of golf, each year?? If you find out, let me know.

[scotty_miller]

Originally Posted by are0lies

You're in for it now. Do you know how many people are hurt, due to the sport of golf, each year?? If you find out, let me know.

*something less dangerous like checkers

[Estoril Blue]

[Estoril Blue]

We should fill all track run-off areas with giant, plush teddy bears. So when people run out of talent - or otherwise screw up....they can land in the huge pile of stuffed teddy bears.

Oh wait - the teddy bears were a distraction and I was mesmerized by their teddy bear cuteness - and then crashed.
-------

Figures that the "I crashed on track and someone else must be to blame." happened in California.

[m3jala]

Big soft pink pillows on the sides with doors every 200 yards to safe spaces you can duck into when you need to recoup because someone in a rubber ducky outfit passed you.

[roastbeef]

Originally Posted by dparm

Damn, that situation sucks. I guess I'm confused by the sandbags as well, but I don't really know the course or motorcycles in general.

I guess I'll be paying attention to the outcome, though I think it's a bit sensationalist to say it could be the start of the end for enthusiast HPDEs or whatever.

Laguna has a lot of elevation changes for a 2.3 mike course. He crashed in an uphill section where they use sandbags to control water and mud from flowing down the track.
They are all around the track, it's no secret or surprise. The guy is an idiot.

[BOOF-M3]

Per the article "Dustin Coyner, a track day operator, Yamaha Champions Riding School instructor and expert-level amateur racer believes Daniel Kim's crash was avoidable". I'll go with the experts opinion on this one.

[Bimmer Barney]

Originally Posted by BOOF-M3

Per the article "Dustin Coyner, a track day operator, Yamaha Champions Riding School instructor and expert-level amateur racer believes Daniel Kim's crash was avoidable". I'll go with the experts opinion on this one.

I know Dustin and used to race with him when I still raced bikes. Straight shooter and knowledgeable. Loved his comments in the article. I hope Kim loses. Insuring these events is an extremely small market. Any case law opening the door to more suits would create real
Problems for operators.

[Richbot]

A good friend bought me a fuzzy leopard print steering wheel cover the first time I crashed a racecar, lol

[Visceral]

Originally Posted by Estoril Blue

Figures that the "I crashed on track and someone else must be to blame." happened in California.

I wouldn't call it California, and you should understand what Oregonians think of Californians.

At least 10% of the Manhattan population is walking around with an attorney on retainer waiting for opportunities like this.

Welcome to "Wealth in America".

[dparm]

Ah yes, the good ole "everything is someone else's fault" meme. What a time to be alive.

[Datka]

OP, I am not a lawyer but I don't think track days will be affected by the outcome of this case.
I don't know anything about bike racing but it does look like that bikes front wheel jumped as soon as he hit that sand bag which caused the accident. So because of those sand bags this guy could win his lawsuit I think.

[Bimmer Barney]

Originally Posted by dparm

Ah yes, the good ole "everything is someone else's fault" meme. What a time to be alive.

I already commented that I hope plaintiff loses, but I would also add this is a good learning lesson for track day operators. When you rent a track, it is your track for that day. If you see something you don’t like, you are entitled to request a change.

AND THE SAME APPLIES IF YOU’RE PAYING TO PARTICIPATE. If you’re a driver or rider and you see something you don’t like, you are entitled to request a change. I have never met someone who would shoot down a change to make it safer. Safety is number one priority, and then lap times.

[The HACK]

Interesting the writer didn't reference the fatal crash at California Speedway. Before that lawsuit went to trial, the same was said about how it was going to END all track days because of the damage they sought.

The lawsuit was ultimately settled by all parties involved, including California Speedway (by then, name and rights sold to Auto Club of Southern California), Ferrari Owner's Club, and Porsche of America for over $13M (probably worth a lot more now that it's almost 15 years later). I suspect that's what the plaintiffs lawyer based on their original demand on. If the families of the two fatalities involved can get $13M and change back then, what would her client be able to get NOW?

The only difference though, is from all accounts there were some REAL negligence in the California Speedway fatal crash. Second (and third hand) info says the organizers did not hire a professional corner crew and Marshall, the Ferrari involved in the crash was sent out on track, hesitated, then went right in front of the Carrera GT, the GT being a handful to drive to start with, and the pit exit on the original course sent cars out right into the path of a hot car.

Despite ALL that.

HPDEs continued to "thrive" at Auto Club Speedway, in fact, DEs are more popular now than ever, with a few dozen organizations all vying for track days at $16,500 per day to rent. Calendar fill up 1 year in advance. ACS resurfaced the entire track 5 years ago. Between the fatal crash and now, 2 additional tracks popped up within an hour drive from ACS.

I suspect this lawsuit isn't going to change a thing. If the plaintiff wins, the cost will get passed onto other consumers and organizers. If the defendants win, the same douche-c*nts that takes zero personal responsibilities for their actions on track will continue to take the same risks and sue the organizers for their own lack of judgement and skills.

[admranger]

Originally Posted by Richbot

A good friend bought me a fuzzy leopard print steering wheel cover the first time I crashed a racecar, lol

Ok, am I the only one who wants to hear about all of the times you crashed a race car?

I hit one guy in my rookie season (probation time...) and got hit two times (from behind, I was going too slowly I think). All were fixed by the dent pro guy (mostly).

I have driven under an airborne race car though. That was scary.

[dparm]

Originally Posted by admranger

I have driven under an airborne race car though. That was scary.

Go on...

[Richbot]

Heh. 5 years in spec Miata = war stories. Also got clover scattered all over my interior by a friend after I kept throwing the car off the track one weekend. We kid because we love

1) first race weekend evah, starting like 7th in a field of 24 spec Miatas or so, first lap car spins in front of me at Hallett, have nowhere to go (probably had somewhere to go but got target fixation) hit front to front with all 4 locked up. Duct taped car together, new radiator, finished 4th on Sunday

2) same track, Hallett, guy from Texas comes from about a mile back in turn 2 and hits me in the door while I was running 3rd-5th ish?. He paid for it which was the classiest thing anyone has done in a contact situation. Really sore after that one.

3) topeka Runoffs practice nationals, field of about 30, I’m running 8th guys racing for 6-7th in front of me get together in turn 1 due to jackassery from an aspiring pro driver (didn’t work out, surprise) and I have nowhere to go even though I lifted seeing the asshattery afoot, ping pinged into the outside wall at about 55. Hardest hit I’ve had, rang my bell hard enough to confuse me for a second I took my helmet off first before getting out of the car and the steering wheel broke off the column

4) c’est fini for my actual crashes, numerous side to side front to back/wheel to wheel oopsies over the years in the Miatas and Spec Wrecker Ford but surprisingly I have only ever had cosmetic damage in the SRF in 9 years in the class. Have backed cars into tire walls a couple times. Scraped walls at Rovals a little too hard...etc. but no more real crashes. Worst was probably last June sprints when a bunch of people at the front of the 4-9th nose to tail pack checked up in turn 1 right when we were all going to the gas, one car climbed up my nose and I had to finish with my nose trying to escape into the atmosphere

Oh and I crashed a prod autocross car when the suspension broke. Was fun for about 20 seconds and then it was draggin frame like an impala. No damage other than the suspension though, heh

[admranger]

Originally Posted by dparm

Go on...

BMW club race at Willow Springs (Don't remember the year, just remember it was hot as hell).

James Sofronas (yeah, that James Sofronas who still races) and two other mod cars were tooth and nail all race. I get lapped (stock class E36M3) late coming down the front straight so I'm right with them into 1 (drafting!). They go into 2 (fast-ish 180 right hander, minimal to no camber to help). One guy sticks his nose in with an optimistic, but should have been ok move right until his front pushes a smidge and he nerfs the car he's under. Nerf'd car goes off track sideways, catches and launches straight up (it seemed to me). I look up through the top of the windshield and see it upside down above me (off to the side, but it looked like it was right over my head). This was one of those "time slowed down" type situations, likely due to my adrenal gland doing crunches like an MMA fighter. Fortunately, I kept my foot down and got out of dodge before it landed and the yard sale ensued. Pieces everywhere.

Good news is guy got out and walked away. There wasn't one piece of sheet metal that wasn't touched on that car and I don't think any of the wheels were on it when it finally stopped moving. It was sobering to witness and a relief once I got back to my trailer and found out the guy was ok (he pitted nearby so I saw him walking around -- I bet he was sore as hell the next day though).