sport display reading 480hp with tune

[8600RPM]

With ess linear piggy and 100 octane my sport guage on I drive hits 480 which is max of the display. This must be some way measuring power as otherwise if it simply used tables of rpm and throttle it wouldn't go above stock 40hp

Thoughts on how it calculates?

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by 8600RPM

With ess linear piggy and 100 octane my sport guage on I drive hits 480 which is max of the display. This must be some way measuring power as otherwise if it simply used tables of rpm and throttle it wouldn't go above stock 40hp

Thoughts on how it calculates?

As I posted in the other thread, my impression is that it approximates power and torque based on the same parameters the ECU uses to establish how much fuel is sent to the engine.

[crypticc]

If anything like n54 tuning it targets load. The n54 load tales have some headroom. Then I would imagine load is then mapped to torque and HP in the idrive.

A piggy won't be as sophisticated as a map but this is a good intro on what both are essentially trying to achieve albeit by different means.
http://accessecu.com/cobbtuningweb/s...lpFile_BMW.pdf

[8600RPM]

Doesn't bode well for piggy not being detectable although I always believed they will be easily found if so e thing happens

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by crypticc

If anything like n54 tuning it targets load. The n54 load tales have some headroom. Then I would imagine load is then mapped to torque and HP in the idrive.

A piggy won't be as sophisticated as a map but this is a good intro on what both are essentially trying to achieve albeit by different means.
http://accessecu.com/cobbtuningweb/s...lpFile_BMW.pdf

Load is the output, so saying that the engine output is based on its output does not answer much does it ?

Load (or torque output) is mostly dependent on mass air flow and RPM, the same parameters used to establish fuel injection requirements .

[CaryTheLabelGuy]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

Load is the output, so saying that the engine output is based on its output does not answer much does it ?

Load (or torque output) is mostly dependent on mass air flow and RPM, the same parameters used to establish fuel injection requirements .

Honest question: Have you ever tuned before?

From an ECU's lookup prospective, LOAD is calculated using various inputs (I.e. Throttle Angle, RPM, MAF, MAP, IAT....etc.). Fuel, Ignition and target boost tables are all dependant on the ECU's calculation of LOAD for lookup in each respective table. The ECU could easily extrapolate its calculated LOAD value against fictitious torque and HP values in another table and spit those values out in the Sports Meter.

Furthermore, fuel and ignition tables ALWAYS have target LOAD overshoot protection. These tables are simply setup beyond normal target LOADs. If the engines overboosts for whatever reason, the ECU can handle this and knows what ignition and fueling should be for said calculated LOAD. It is not far fetched for the Sports Gauges to be able to continue extrapolating "torque and HP" past the regular target LOAD values.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by CaryTheLabelGuy

Honest question: Have you ever tuned before?

This is certainly not my area of expertise. I am open to be educated on the topic

Originally Posted by CaryTheLabelGuy

From an ECU's lookup prospective, LOAD is calculated using various inputs (I.e. Throttle Angle, RPM, MAF, MAP, IAT....etc.). Fuel, Ignition and target boost tables are all dependant on the ECU's calculation of LOAD for lookup in each respective table.

Furthermore, fuel and ignition tables ALWAYS have target LOAD overshoot protection. These tables are simply setup beyond normal target LOADs. If the engines overboosts for whatever reason, the ECU can handle this and knows what ignition and fueling should be for said calculated LOAD. It is not far fetched for the Sports Gauges to be able to continue extrapolating "torque and HP" past the regular target LOAD values.

I think in general we are saying the same thing. I did say "mostly dependent" on mass air flow and RPM. Throttle angle, MAP, IAT are all used to calculate mass air flow. My understanding is that other parameters are also used for fine tuning.

Further, I am guessing that the calculated "actual" load values are used for the Sport Display as opposed to the "target" load values.

I struggle to understand this sentence though:

Originally Posted by CaryTheLabelGuy

The ECU could easily extrapolate its calculated LOAD value against fictitious torque and HP values in another table and spit those values out in the Sports Meter.

I guess you mean it the other way around, where the ECU estimates the power and torque output to be displayed based on the calculated actual "load".

[CaryTheLabelGuy]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

This is certainly not my area of expertise.



I think in general we are saying the same thing. I did say "mostly dependent" on mass air flow and RPM. Throttle angle, MAP, IAT are all used to calculate mass air flow. My understanding is that other parameters are also used for fine tuning.

I struggle to understand this sentence though:


I guess you mean it the other way around, where the ECU estimates the power and torque output to be displayed based on the calculated actual (as opposed to target) "load".

Throttle Angle, MAP(Manifold Absolute Pressure sensor), MAF(Mass Airflow sensor), RPM, IAT(Intake Air Temperature sensor), Barometric Pressure are ALL used to calculate LOAD, Mass Airflow is only one part of the calculation, not THE calculation. LOAD is the end calculation derived from all of these inputs. Target LOAD is just that, a target.

As for the last part of your reply, I mean it just how I'm saying it. The ECU is estimating power/torque from calculated LOAD, the same calculated LOAD the ECU is using to lookup fueling and ignition table values.

Hope this makes more sense.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by CaryTheLabelGuy

Throttle Angle, MAP(Manifold Absolute Pressure sensor), MAF(Mass Airflow sensor), RPM, IAT(Intake Air Temperature sensor), Barometric Pressure are ALL used to calculate LOAD, Mass Airflow is only one part of the calculation, not THE calculation. LOAD is the end calculation derived from all of these inputs. Target LOAD is just that, a target.

When I say "mass air flow", I mean the actual rate of air mass entering the engine, not the output of a single sensor. Isn't the actual mass air flow entering the engine dependent on the Throttle position, RPM, MAP, MAF, IAT, Baro? Further, isn't the calculated actual "load" directly proportional to the torque output of the engine?

BTW, I am not trying to argue, I just want to understand.

Originally Posted by CaryTheLabelGuy

As for the last part of your reply, I mean it just how I'm saying it. The ECU is estimating power/torque from calculated LOAD, the same calculated LOAD the ECU is using to lookup fueling and ignition table values.

Hope this makes more sense.

Yes, this makes more sense. But you did say it the other way around in your other post .

And isn't this exactly what I wrote in the second post of this thread .

[8600RPM]

The point of what I learned today is the power display is much more than a simple gimmick that references a preset #based on rpm and throttle input. It's clearly reading a,tune and possibly higher octane. I will turn tune off and with just 100 octane see what power I hit to compare.

Other lesson is no piggy back is undetectable in the least. Clearly the ecu reads and sees the added load or flow or whatever parameter, and spits out a higher than stock power figure.

Buyers beware and tune at own risk.

It was nice to see power pegged at 480 knowing that was the max reading of the guage and that it was likely putting out a lot more. Ess dyno shows 460 who for linear tune.

[Powaup]

Originally Posted by 8600RPM

With ess linear piggy and 100 octane my sport guage on I drive hits 480 which is max of the display. This must be some way measuring power as otherwise if it simply used tables of rpm and throttle it wouldn't go above stock 40hp

Thoughts on how it calculates?

FYI I can get to 480 hp stock on the sport display

[8600RPM]

Stock on 91 or 93? Well that's interesting!

[Powaup]

Originally Posted by 8600RPM

Stock on 91 or 93? Well that's interesting!

91 octane