[solefald]

Here is our bailout cash... hard at work... in China....

http://www.leftlanenews.com/gm-to-im...s-by-2011.html

Chinese automakers like Chery and BYD have been trying to break into the U.S. market for years, but General Motors could become the first automaker to sell China-made vehicles in America. A new document reveals GM is planning to sell China-made cars in the U.S. by 2011.

According to the document acquired by Automotive News, General Motors plans on selling about 17,300 China-made vehicles in the U.S. in 2011. The number is expected to blossom to 51,500 units by the year 2014.
The document also reveals GM expects its U.S. sales to grow by 50 percent by the year 2014.
Automotive News suggests the China-made vehicles will be small cars similar to the upcoming Chevrolet Spark, but we wouldn’t completely rule out the possibility of a compact sedan for Buick. China is Buick’s largest market and an inside source has revealed GM is planning a smaller, Delta-based sedan for its U.S. Buick division. GM’s expected sales figures would also seem to fall in line with an entry-level Buick sedan.
However, GM’s China import plans could change in the coming months, pending forthcoming negotiations with the UAW. However, even at 2014’s increased sales levels China-made cars would only account for 1.6 percent of GM’s overall sales, so the UAW isn’t expected to throw up a huge road block.

And this is what is going to happen to you if you buy one of those and get into 40mph car crash.

[808six]

fail.

[TK-421]

Shouldn't the bailout funds be used not only to help the automakers, but to be put back into the economy?

[Crimson92]

scary

[RonJon]

Keep in mind that the video is for a Chinese engineered, designed and built vehicle. The crumple zone of that vehicle is very poorly designed, nothing todo with how that vehicle was manufactured.

GM vehicles wouldn't perform the same as that video because the design of the vehicle would have a better crumple zone. Just because its Chinese made it doesn’t mean Chinese quality. (although I am not suggesting to import Chinese made vehicles to NA)

If you were to visit a UAW plant and see what kind of shenanigans goes on in a US plant, you'd be surprised how they get away with such crappy workmanship.

[themonotron]

^+1

chinese made cars in their regular forms will not pass the safety standards in the United States. If GM does import them here, obviously, the crash ratings and occupant safety will have to be up to U.S. standards or else the car will, again obviously, be prohibited in our market.

[solefald]

Originally Posted by RonJon

Keep in mind that the video is for a Chinese engineered, designed and built vehicle. The crumple zone of that vehicle is very poorly designed, nothing todo with how that vehicle was manufactured.

GM vehicles wouldn't perform the same as that video because the design of the vehicle would have a better crumple zone. Just because its Chinese made it doesn’t mean Chinese quality. (although I am not suggesting to import Chinese made vehicles to NA)

If you were to visit a UAW plant and see what kind of shenanigans goes on in a US plant, you'd be surprised how they get away with such crappy workmanship.

Right, but why should an American automotive giant even be allowed to buy cars elsewhere? Aren't their sole purpose to make cars, here, in States?

Didn't they cry about having to close factories and lay off their workers, then asked for our money to stop that from happening? Didn't they get the money they were asking for?

Why would they turn around and buy cars from elsewhere, essentially pissing off the American consumer and digging their own grave as if the quality of their products wasn't bad enough already?

How does that improve US economy or give jobs back to people who lost them in the first place? Or this is what we call innovation now days - finding new ways to profit, without investing in the first place?

[TK-421]

Originally Posted by RonJon

Keep in mind that the video is for a Chinese engineered, designed and built vehicle. The crumple zone of that vehicle is very poorly designed, nothing todo with how that vehicle was manufactured.

GM vehicles wouldn't perform the same as that video because the design of the vehicle would have a better crumple zone. Just because its Chinese made it doesn’t mean Chinese quality. (although I am not suggesting to import Chinese made vehicles to NA)

If you were to visit a UAW plant and see what kind of shenanigans goes on in a US plant, you'd be surprised how they get away with such crappy workmanship.

Yeah, really. Most unions FTL. They get way too many benefits and say in regards to the little they do

Originally Posted by solefald

Right, but why should an American automotive giant even be allowed to buy cars elsewhere? Aren't their sole purpose to make cars, here, in States?

Didn't they cry about having to close factories and lay off their workers, then asked for our money to stop that from happening? Didn't they get the money they were asking for?

Why would they turn around and buy cars from elsewhere, essentially pissing off the American consumer and digging their own grave as if the quality of their products wasn't bad enough already?

How does that improve US economy or give jobs back to people who lost them in the first place? Or this is what we call innovation now days - finding new ways to profit, without investing in the first place?

+8675309

Expanding on what I said earlier. With this happening, I think GM should get verbally raped again by congress, but this time about outsourcing US bailout money. some people just won't learn. If shit like this keeps happening, it's time for an even more drastic overhaul of GM or for them to exist only in the pages of history. You need to amputate limb to save the body (or however the cliché goes)

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by solefald

Aren't their sole purpose to make cars, here, in States?

No their sole purpose is to make money.

I love the way people get all up in arms about a car maker building cars overseas, but 95% of EVERYTHING you buy is made in places other than the US. No one seemed to care when we stopped making TVs here, or shoes, or clothes even when it put millions of manufacturing workers out of jobs over the last four decades.

When all the other companies are taking advanatage of cheap labor rates in China, why shouldn't a car maker? Does anyone really think they can compete here paying US wages and benefits?

I work in the industry, and I don't want to see this happen, but it amazes me how many people will rant and rave about it while typing on a computer made in singapore, resting on a desk made in China, sitting on a chair made in Tiawan, wearing jeans made in Mexico, and shoes made in Korea.

What did we think was going to happen?

[BForbes]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

No their sole purpose it to make money.

I love the way people get all up in arms about a car maker building cars overseas, but 95% of EVERYTHING you buy is made in places other than the US. No one seemed to care when we stopped making TVs here, or shoes, or clothes even when it put millions of manufacturing workers out of jobs over the last four decades.

When all the other companies are taking advanatage of cheap labor rates in China, why shouldn't a car maker? Does anyone really think they can compete here paying US wages and benefits?

I work in the industry, and I don't want to see this happen, but it amazes me how many people will rant and rave about it while typing on a computer made in singapore, resting on a desk made in China, sitting on a chair made in Tiawan, wearing jeans made in Mexico, and shoes made in Korea.

What did we think was going to happen?

x 1,000,000 Jeremy. Very well said.

[solefald]

Originally Posted by jeremyc74

No their sole purpose is to make money.

I love the way people get all up in arms about a car maker building cars overseas, but 95% of EVERYTHING you buy is made in places other than the US. No one seemed to care when we stopped making TVs here, or shoes, or clothes even when it put millions of manufacturing workers out of jobs over the last four decades.

When all the other companies are taking advanatage of cheap labor rates in China, why shouldn't a car maker? Does anyone really think they can compete here paying US wages and benefits?

I work in the industry, and I don't want to see this happen, but it amazes me how many people will rant and rave about it while typing on a computer made in singapore, resting on a desk made in China, sitting on a chair made in Tiawan, wearing jeans made in Mexico, and shoes made in Korea.

What did we think was going to happen?

i completely understand this, but we are talking about a company that just got a boatload of cash from US taxpayers to stay afloat! some of this cash comes from the pockets of people they laid off, and those people's children and grandchildren for years to come.

i don't see any bailed out banks suddenly switching to ¥, € or £ because it will bring them more profits. i know it is a strange analogy, but in Russia, for example, you could take a bank loan in ANY currency you desire.. and banks allow that, because at the end it brings them more money due to exchange rates.

what i am saying - there have to be rules and regulations applied to the companies that got bailout funds. if you didn't get any money from the government, i don't give a shit how you make your profits. if you are cowardly enough to use little children in Bangladesh to make your product in some sweatshop, so be it, but dang, if you got our money to stay afloat, shut the fuck up and deal with it by putting back into the jar you got all this money from in the first place.

[shipill]

shit I should have bought this baby instead of E92 335 !

[solefald]

Originally Posted by shipill

shit I should have bought this baby instead of E92 335 !

totally.

i wonder what cars they use for demolition derby in china? lol

[SoCali E36]

Originally Posted by solefald

totally.

i wonder what cars they use for demolition derby in china? lol

you dont want to know.

[JB135i]

What a nice big FU to the American taxpayer who put up hard earned funds to bailout GM.

I don't have a problem with using cheaper labor (UAW FTL) but NOT AFTER we already poured billions of dollars into GM to save American (North American) jobs.

I am no fan of the UAW, but what an FU to them too, damn.

So what we end up with at a GM dealership is, a Chinese car with an Obama/Govt warranty and guaranteed value at trade...yeh that will work LOL.

It's almost like GM is trying to completely go under. Or maybe this was a figurative warning shot at Obama? Maybe GM is saying back off a bit, or we will really screw this company over?

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by solefald

i completely understand this, but we are talking about a company that just got a boatload of cash from US taxpayers to stay afloat! some of this cash comes from the pockets of people they laid off, and those people's children and grandchildren for years to come.

i don't see any bailed out banks suddenly switching to ¥, € or £ because it will bring them more profits. i know it is a strange analogy, but in Russia, for example, you could take a bank loan in ANY currency you desire.. and banks allow that, because at the end it brings them more money due to exchange rates.

.

Several of the banks that got bailout funds invested it in China. It made headlines a couple of times, and they got their hand slapped for it.

One of two things is going to happen with GM.

A - They're going to go into bankruptcy, likely never emerge, and the tax money will have been wasted.

B - They're going to have to find a way to build cars cheaper than their competition to get back on level ground, and China may be the way they do that.

Either way, the American auto industry as we know it is gone, thanks to greedy executives. I'm not saying that going to China is the right thing for GM to do, but if they had done it years ago, they probalby wouldn't have needed the taxpayer's money.

Outsourcing cars to China isn't any more wrong than outsourcing shoes or clothes, and we're all buying that stuff every day.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by JB135i

What a nice big FU to the American taxpayer who put up hard earned funds to bailout GM.

I don't have a problem with using cheaper labor (UAW FTL) but NOT AFTER we already poured billions of dollars into GM to save American (North American) jobs.

I am no fan of the UAW, but what an FU to them too, damn.

So what we end up with at a GM dealership is, a Chinese car with an Obama/Govt warranty and guaranteed value at trade...yeh that will work LOL.

It's almost like GM is trying to completely go under. Or maybe this was a figurative warning shot at Obama? Maybe GM is saying back off a bit, or we will really screw this company over?

Maybe GM is sending a wake-up call to the American public. Why should auto makers play by different rules than every other manufacturer in the country? It was Ok for my Grandparents jobs in the clothing industry, or my mother's job in the woodworking industry to be outsourced, why not automotive jobs as well?

(And just in case some of you haven't noticed already...the point I'm getting at isn't that it's OK for GM to do this, but that it's wrong for ALL companies to do it and American consumers are going to have to realize it.)

[johnnymu]

You do know 24% of GM cars are being built oversea this year? It's estimated 5 years from now there will be more USA made toyota than GM. bailout money was never for the poor it was for the rich only.

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by johnnymu

You do know 24% of GM cars are being built oversea this year? It's estimated 5 years from now there will be more USA made toyota than GM. bailout money was never for the poor it was for the rich only.

You do realize that that most of that 24% is also being sold overseas right? The vast majority of GM's domestic offerings are currently built in North America. The G8, Aveo, and Saturn Astra are the only ones I can think of off the top of my head that are sold in the US but not built in NA.

Toyota still imports a LOT more vehicles to the US than GM does.

[johnnymu]

maybe I should reword it this year 24% of GM cars here in USA will be made else where. This does not include international sales

[FStop7]

LAWL so the bailout money goes to support China and GM is closing 3,000 dealerships in the USA, which means (assuming 25 employees per dealership) at least 75,000 lost jobs.

Good work!

[jeremyc74]

Originally Posted by johnnymu

maybe I should reword it this year 24% of GM cars here in USA will be made else where. This does not include international sales

Does not compute. Source and model list please.