Bilstein B16 DampTronic vs KW DDC Plug & Play

conejodenieve · 05-20-2021, 01:26 PM

Good morning everyone!

I have tried to research both coilovers but there don't seem to be many detailed reviews on either. My RWD 340i now has 70k miles so I'm starting to look at replacement options for shocks. I figured I'd look into coilovers to slightly lower the car. The car is currently our road trip car and my DD so I'd like something that is still comfortable in comfort mode.

I'm looking at the Bilstein B16 DampTronic Coilovers:
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-bilstein...49-255935~bil/

and the KW DDC Plug & Play coilovers:
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-kw-suspe...t/39020018~kw/

I have read that the Bilsteins are overly stiff and that they don't lower the car much.
I have also read that the KWs lower the car too much even on the highest setting.
I'm only looking to lower the car slightly at the moment as my current rear wheel set up is pretty aggressive (maybe down the line I'll buy different wheels and be able to lower the car more)

I wanted to ask for some contributions from the community about their experience with either of these coilover options as well as current height set up and pictures.

I would like to retain the factory Comfort/Sport button function. From what I've read so far, it seems like I'll end up having to pick one of the lesser evils.

Any help is greatly appreciated!

exE36M3 · 05-20-2021, 03:32 PM

So.... something to consider as I assume you have the adaptive suspension like I do.

I recently just went back to the stock springs after one year of tinkering with my suspension.

1. Eibach pro-kit springs .8" drop front / Eibach sport springs rear .8" drop
2. Millway camber plates
3. Dinan shockware

Not a coil set-up, but we are only talking .8" here which is pretty mild.
So... what was the result of this project?

GOOD
1. The Eibach springs got me to the drop I wanted... roughy 1 finger between tire and fender. Looked awesome. Good around the town, low-speed ride and handling.
2. Camber plates improved handling substantially - think 90mph+ on the tail of a '21 Vette on freeway flyover and he was too scared to accelerate away
3. Shock software put sport in comfort mode and sport+ in sport mode. So more firmer ride.

BAD
1. With only .8" drop, adaptive shocks didn't response to abrupt road surfaces (think _---- or /––––\ ), so the front end would bottom out, as in tire rubbing the inside fender. At highway speeds, this was MORE apparent as our freeways and roads have some serious dips (those oil hotspots you see).
2. Camber plates... rattled (NOT ALL DO, but mine did)
3. Shockware helped with the bottoming out, but no enough.

So back to stock height, stock adaptive shocks, stock springs... kept Dinan Shockware.
The car is amazing with my 19x9-235/40 and 19x10-265/35 tires/wheels. No bottoming out, slight lean in turns.

In my opinion, the stock adaptive shocks are programmed to function within a certain range and respond accordingly. Once you shorten that range (lowering the car), the software just doesn't know what to do. So the response isn't very good.

I didn't go with the KW, Bilstein EDC compatible systems because it's still the same dilemma.
The brain that controls the dampening system isn't on the shock, it's in the car.

Others may chime in also, but from my experience - many people just code out the EDC (or run cancellers) and run the traditional suspension upgrades (spring/coil/adjustable shock).

If I were to do it again, I'd buy compatible (car) coil-overs with adjustable shocks and code out the EDC.

therealm3 · 05-20-2021, 04:56 PM

@exE36M3 - Interesting that you went back to stock height. I have been tinkering a bit too and lately have been thinking about going back to stock too. Or very close to it with a set of M3 springs I have. Like you said, the car just seemed to react to stuff better at that height. Who knows. I guess I could always switch back and all I am out is an alignment and my time. Hahaha. I really like how my car looks lowered but maybe this adaptive suspension just isn't cut out for it like you said.

Did you keep the mono ball thrust arms too or go back to stock? I swapped stock ones back in chasing a rattle. Now I am on the fence of putting the mono ball back. It wasn't the source of my rattle but did eliminate a few buzzes I had on the interior. Lost some of that crisp steering n the process which is a bummer.

conejodenieve · 05-20-2021, 05:17 PM

So to respond to both of you guys, I have also thought about staying stock height and just replacing the shocks with OEM shocks. I really like the functionality of stock height but I'm sure the car would look nicer lowered.

I just figured, since the OEM shocks are already super expensive, there had to be some good aftermarket solution for retaining the adaptive dampening.

M3exDeo · 05-20-2021, 06:00 PM

Just today I started researching adaptive suspension upgrades for my '13 335xi. I had to replace my front struts last August (only 2k miles ago!), and I'm about to do the rears. I really like the M adaptive suspension and I'd like to continue to use it, but I need/want to close up the wheel gap. I'm going to scan the F80 forum; I wonder if the F80 adaptive suspension is similar enough to compare users' experiences with the B16 and the KW DDC.

conejodenieve · 05-20-2021, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MindFire

Just today I started researching adaptive suspension upgrades for my '13 335xi. I had to replace my front struts last August (only 2k miles ago!), and I'm about to do the rears. I really like the M adaptive suspension and I'd like to continue to use it, but I need/want to close up the wheel gap. I'm going to scan the F80 forum; I wonder if the F80 adaptive suspension is similar enough to compare users' experiences with the B16 and the KW DDC.

So there are several accounts on the F80 thread. Like you said though, I'm not sure how different our cars would feel with the same aftermarket adaptive options

Jvac · 05-20-2021, 09:01 PM

I think the adaptive suspension is overpriced and doesn't do a good job in comfort or sport mode. I have been running it for 3 years now and it just stinks. It can be coded out easily, and at that point you are free to run the suspension system of your choice. Otherwise, as the guys above have said, it won't be any better if you lower it and try to squeeze more performance out of it. It just doesn't have any more to give. And these other "ddc" or damptronic options aren't ideal either. They are made to fit a wide variety of 3 series cars and therefore they won't be optimized for any one in particular. You'll find they are too stiff, not stiff enough, or lacking in small, large, or small and large bump compliance. Leave it as is, or give up on adaptive altogether.

exE36M3 · 05-20-2021, 11:16 PM

The above proof, there is life after being lowered.

The 235/40 and 265/35 enlarge the wheel diameter by .4" and .3" so it takes up some of the wheel gap while still giving some room between the road and rim.

therealm3 - yeah, I pulled the Turner Monoballs out too. I did it chasing the camber plate rattle to no avail. The car rode so quietly without the monoball, I just left them off and sold them. The roads are so crappy around the Bay Area, we just need that suspension travel and some tire. (That and the F3X camber doesn't arc at all like previous BMWs so it's almost like, what's the point).

The rattles, fender rub, noise, ride quality, etc. - ok when I was 20-ish. At 50... yeah, I'll take comfy and being able to drive at the limit with predictable control.

But again, if you all find yourself driving around in Sport Mode because of the ride and why the car handles, the Dinan Shockware is pretty nice and cheap for $199 and 1/2 labor.

@Jvac - yep. The issue really is how the EDC shocks are tuned. I'm actually kid of surprised there isn't a software upgrade for EDC like Bootmod3 or MDC for the motor. It's like +/- more rebound and +/- for jounce and maybe for drop.

johnung · 05-21-2021, 06:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conejodenieve

Good morning everyone!

I have tried to research both coilovers but there don't seem to be many detailed reviews on either. My RWD 340i now has 70k miles so I'm starting to look at replacement options for shocks. I figured I'd look into coilovers to slightly lower the car. The car is currently our road trip car and my DD so I'd like something that is still comfortable in comfort mode.

I'm looking at the Bilstein B16 DampTronic Coilovers:
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-bilstein...49-255935~bil/

and the KW DDC Plug & Play coilovers:
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-kw-suspe...t/39020018~kw/

I have read that the Bilsteins are overly stiff and that they don't lower the car much.
I have also read that the KWs lower the car too much even on the highest setting.
I'm only looking to lower the car slightly at the moment as my current rear wheel set up is pretty aggressive (maybe down the line I'll buy different wheels and be able to lower the car more)

I wanted to ask for some contributions from the community about their experience with either of these coilover options as well as current height set up and pictures.

I would like to retain the factory Comfort/Sport button function. From what I've read so far, it seems like I'll end up having to pick one of the lesser evils.

Any help is greatly appreciated!

Guys focus on the Bilstein dampers being set too stiff from the factory, which is true. But with the B16's, Bilstein also provides overly stiff springs. It can really be teeth rattling as a daily driver.

KW has a reputation for high quality along with a more comfortable ride. The KW lowering range for your car is front 0.4"-1.4" and rear 0.2"-1.4". That seems perfect. You should be able to adjust your ride height exactly where you like it.

I have buddies with B16's and with KW's. It's not even close from how their cars ride. IMO get the KW's.

therealm3 · 05-21-2021, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exE36M3

But again, if you all find yourself driving around in Sport Mode because of the ride and why the car handles, the Dinan Shockware is pretty nice and cheap for $199 and 1/2 labor.

@Jvac - yep. The issue really is how the EDC shocks are tuned. I'm actually kid of surprised there isn't a software upgrade for EDC like Bootmod3 or MDC for the motor. It's like +/- more rebound and +/- for jounce and maybe for drop.

This is odd to me too. If Dinan found a way to alter the shock profiles i am sure there are others who could do the same and make it into a BootMode type of thing. I'd love that cause I think the perfect setup is about 75% of the factory sport setting.

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnung

Guys focus on the Bilstein dampers being set too stiff from the factory, which is true. But with the B16's, Bilstein also provides overly stiff springs. It can really be teeth rattling as a daily driver.

I am currently riding on the B16's and don't find it as bad as some make it out to be. If you have ever owned an M car it will feel familiar. Yes, it is stiff, but the dampers do a good job of controlling the springs and it rides well. Only beef I have is on crappy roads at lower speeds. the sharp small bumps can be noisy. Other than that its a nice set up. The Keis Motorsports guys love B16's if you watch their reviews and videos. Also here is a great review from a guy who has an F80 as well:

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=26569059

He is a track driving instructor so he would know a thing or two about how a car should drive. He says his F80 comp rides stiffer than the B16 F30.

Unfortunately for me my car serves dual purpose for the family and we can't get anything bigger for another year and a half till my wife's lease is up. The kids and wife are not thrilled about riding in my car over long distances now, so I may go back to stock-ish to avoid the complaints.

cfm56d7b · 05-21-2021, 11:53 AM

conejodenieve, my own situation is very similar to yours.

My 2017 BMW 440i GC has M Adaptive suspension. BMW's M Adaptive suspension is good but but not exceptional. The rebound / compression cycles can be best described as lethargic. In Sport mode, the suspension bounces instead of rapidly absorbing road imperfection while maintaining the suspension geometry and contact with the road.

My goals are identical to yours:

- Maintain OEM suspension height
- Retain OEM Comfort / Sport Mode functionality
- Improve suspension behavior without compromising comfort (and that's where the choices are limited)

After waiting for a long time for Bilstein B16 Damptronic coilovers, inability to maintain OEM suspension height became a barrier to purchase.

So there are 2 more options from Bilstein: B4 Damptronic and B6 Damptronic shocks.

Both B4 Damptonic and B6 Damptronic shocks can be used with OEM springs while maintaining OEM suspension height.

B6 Damptronic is much stiffer in Sport mode, perhaps too stiff as reported be a fellow forum member:

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...TRONIC&page=11

So this leaves B4 Damptronic shocks as the only choice for now.

Excellent article explaining the full range of Bilstein products:

https://www.potn.co.uk/bilstein-range-explained/

johnung · 05-21-2021, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by therealm3

Quote:

Originally Posted by exE36M3

But again, if you all find yourself driving around in Sport Mode because of the ride and why the car handles, the Dinan Shockware is pretty nice and cheap for $199 and 1/2 labor.

@Jvac - yep. The issue really is how the EDC shocks are tuned. I'm actually kid of surprised there isn't a software upgrade for EDC like Bootmod3 or MDC for the motor. It's like +/- more rebound and +/- for jounce and maybe for drop.

This is odd to me too. If Dinan found a way to alter the shock profiles i am sure there are others who could do the same and make it into a BootMode type of thing. I'd love that cause I think the perfect setup is about 75% of the factory sport setting.

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnung

Guys focus on the Bilstein dampers being set too stiff from the factory, which is true. But with the B16's, Bilstein also provides overly stiff springs. It can really be teeth rattling as a daily driver.

I am currently riding on the B16's and don't find it as bad as some make it out to be. If you have ever owned an M car it will feel familiar. Yes, it is stiff, but the dampers do a good job of controlling the springs and it rides well. Only beef I have is on crappy roads at lower speeds. the sharp small bumps can be noisy. Other than that its a nice set up. The Keis Motorsports guys love B16's if you watch their reviews and videos. Also here is a great review from a guy who has an F80 as well:

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=26569059

He is a track driving instructor so he would know a thing or two about how a car should drive. He says his F80 comp rides stiffer than the B16 F30.

Unfortunately for me my car serves dual purpose for the family and we can't get anything bigger for another year and a half till my wife's lease is up. The kids and wife are not thrilled about riding in my car over long distances now, so I may go back to stock-ish to avoid the complaints.

FYI- you are absolutely correct about favorable comments from Kies Motorsports about the B16's. But also keep in mind that the Kies Bilstein B16's were installed in a video that was made a while ago on a 335ix that was being converted into a track car with an upgraded turbo and a roll cage. Definitely not a daily driver.

The latest Kies suspension video shows an installation of KW coilovers on Chris's 340ix street car. Link below.

johnung · 05-21-2021, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cfm56d7b

conejodenieve, my own situation is very similar to yours.

My 2017 BMW 440i GC has M Adaptive suspension. BMW's M Adaptive suspension is good but but not exceptional. The rebound / compression cycles can be best described as lethargic. In Sport mode, the suspension bounces instead of rapidly absorbing road imperfection while maintaining the suspension geometry and contact with the road.

My goals are identical to yours:

- Maintain OEM suspension height
- Retain OEM Comfort / Sport Mode functionality
- Improve suspension behavior without compromising comfort (and that's where the choices are limited)

After waiting for a long time for Bilstein B16 Damptronic coilovers, inability to maintain OEM suspension height became a barrier to purchase.

So there are 2 more options from Bilstein: B4 Damptronic and B6 Damptronic shocks.

Both B4 Damptonic and B6 Damptronic shocks can be used with OEM springs while maintaining OEM suspension height.

B6 Damptronic is much stiffer in Sport mode, perhaps too stiff as reported be a fellow forum member:

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...IC&page=11

So this leaves B4 Damptronic shocks as the only choice for now.

Excellent article explaining the full range of Bilstein products:

https://www.potn.co.uk/bilstein-range-explained/

I've often heard that B4's are Bilstein's cheap replacement shock, but that B6 use much higher level materials and design. I assume it's the same for their Damptronic/EDC versions.

Have you tried communicating with Bilstein technical support in US and Germany? Before Covid I attended a large distributor event and spoke with an excellent tech guy from Bilstein Germany. Maybe they can provide some further insight on how EDC is implemented in their B4 and B6 offerings.

I keep hearing very positive things about KW. May be worth considering as well.

cfm56d7b · 05-21-2021, 12:51 PM

johnung, you are 100% correct. I am currently researching EDC implementation differences (if any) in B4 Damptronic and B6 Damptronic shocks. Will share my findings later.

cfm56d7b · 05-21-2021, 06:03 PM

Just get a response from Bilstein.

"There is no interpretation left up to the dampers, they are run by a program that the ECU controls."

Makes sense since B4 Damptronic and B6 Damptronic functionality is controlled by the ECU software. Any performance differences are a result of the internal valving and other changes.

435gc · 05-22-2021, 09:12 AM

Would love to know if the b4 damptronic are an improvement over the stock edc

435gc · 05-22-2021, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exE36M3

So.... something to consider as I assume you have the adaptive suspension like I do.

I recently just went back to the stock springs after one year of tinkering with my suspension.

1. Eibach pro-kit springs .8" drop front / Eibach sport springs rear .8" drop
2. Millway camber plates
3. Dinan shockware

Not a coil set-up, but we are only talking .8" here which is pretty mild.
So... what was the result of this project?

GOOD
1. The Eibach springs got me to the drop I wanted... roughy 1 finger between tire and fender. Looked awesome. Good around the town, low-speed ride and handling.
2. Camber plates improved handling substantially - think 90mph+ on the tail of a '21 Vette on freeway flyover and he was too scared to accelerate away
3. Shock software put sport in comfort mode and sport+ in sport mode. So more firmer ride.

BAD
1. With only .8" drop, adaptive shocks didn't response to abrupt road surfaces (think _---- or /––––\ ), so the front end would bottom out, as in tire rubbing the inside fender. At highway speeds, this was MORE apparent as our freeways and roads have some serious dips (those oil hotspots you see).
2. Camber plates... rattled (NOT ALL DO, but mine did)
3. Shockware helped with the bottoming out, but no enough.

So back to stock height, stock adaptive shocks, stock springs... kept Dinan Shockware.
The car is amazing with my 19x9-235/40 and 19x10-265/35 tires/wheels. No bottoming out, slight lean in turns.

In my opinion, the stock adaptive shocks are programmed to function within a certain range and respond accordingly. Once you shorten that range (lowering the car), the software just doesn't know what to do. So the response isn't very good.

I didn't go with the KW, Bilstein EDC compatible systems because it's still the same dilemma.
The brain that controls the dampening system isn't on the shock, it's in the car.

Others may chime in also, but from my experience - many people just code out the EDC (or run cancellers) and run the traditional suspension upgrades (spring/coil/adjustable shock).

If I were to do it again, I'd buy compatible (car) coil-overs with adjustable shocks and code out the EDC.

Really surprised to hear you were getting fender well rubbing with the eibach pro kit. I thought the drop was too mild for this to happen. Were you running larger than 19in wheels?

therealm3 · 05-22-2021, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 435gc

Quote:

Originally Posted by exE36M3

So.... something to consider as I assume you have the adaptive suspension like I do.

I recently just went back to the stock springs after one year of tinkering with my suspension.

1. Eibach pro-kit springs .8" drop front / Eibach sport springs rear .8" drop
2. Millway camber plates
3. Dinan shockware

Not a coil set-up, but we are only talking .8" here which is pretty mild.
So... what was the result of this project?

GOOD
1. The Eibach springs got me to the drop I wanted... roughy 1 finger between tire and fender. Looked awesome. Good around the town, low-speed ride and handling.
2. Camber plates improved handling substantially - think 90mph+ on the tail of a '21 Vette on freeway flyover and he was too scared to accelerate away
3. Shock software put sport in comfort mode and sport+ in sport mode. So more firmer ride.

BAD
1. With only .8" drop, adaptive shocks didn't response to abrupt road surfaces (think _---- or /––––\ ), so the front end would bottom out, as in tire rubbing the inside fender. At highway speeds, this was MORE apparent as our freeways and roads have some serious dips (those oil hotspots you see).
2. Camber plates... rattled (NOT ALL DO, but mine did)
3. Shockware helped with the bottoming out, but no enough.

So back to stock height, stock adaptive shocks, stock springs... kept Dinan Shockware.
The car is amazing with my 19x9-235/40 and 19x10-265/35 tires/wheels. No bottoming out, slight lean in turns.

In my opinion, the stock adaptive shocks are programmed to function within a certain range and respond accordingly. Once you shorten that range (lowering the car), the software just doesn't know what to do. So the response isn't very good.

I didn't go with the KW, Bilstein EDC compatible systems because it's still the same dilemma.
The brain that controls the dampening system isn't on the shock, it's in the car.

Others may chime in also, but from my experience - many people just code out the EDC (or run cancellers) and run the traditional suspension upgrades (spring/coil/adjustable shock).

If I were to do it again, I'd buy compatible (car) coil-overs with adjustable shocks and code out the EDC.

Really surprised to hear you were getting fender well rubbing with the eibach pro kit. I thought the drop was too mild for this to happen. Were you running larger than 19in wheels?

I am guessing it had to do with the mono ball thrust arms adding caster (pushing the wheel forward) and the slightly oversized tire setup.

exE36M3 · 05-22-2021, 10:48 AM

therealm3 - No change with the position of the wheel with the Monoball Thrust arm. Caster remained the same.

Admittedly, some of my issues were were offet + tire choice BUT, after tilting the camber to -2 to allow the wheel to tuck into the funder,
it stopped rubbing the inside edge of the fender and *started* hitting the fender inside itself. :\

So yeah, the pairing of the EDC shock (even in Sport mode) with a progressive rate spring just didn't go so well.

05-20-2021, 01:26 PM	#1
conejodenieve Enlisted Member 49 Rep 30 Posts Drives: BMW 340i Join Date: Nov 2019 Location: California iTrader: (0)	Bilstein B16 DampTronic vs KW DDC Plug & Play Good morning everyone! I have tried to research both coilovers but there don't seem to be many detailed reviews on either. My RWD 340i now has 70k miles so I'm starting to look at replacement options for shocks. I figured I'd look into coilovers to slightly lower the car. The car is currently our road trip car and my DD so I'd like something that is still comfortable in comfort mode. I'm looking at the Bilstein B16 DampTronic Coilovers: https://www.ecstuning.com/b-bilstein...49-255935~bil/ and the KW DDC Plug & Play coilovers: https://www.ecstuning.com/b-kw-suspe...t/39020018~kw/ I have read that the Bilsteins are overly stiff and that they don't lower the car much. I have also read that the KWs lower the car too much even on the highest setting. I'm only looking to lower the car slightly at the moment as my current rear wheel set up is pretty aggressive (maybe down the line I'll buy different wheels and be able to lower the car more) I wanted to ask for some contributions from the community about their experience with either of these coilover options as well as current height set up and pictures. I would like to retain the factory Comfort/Sport button function. From what I've read so far, it seems like I'll end up having to pick one of the lesser evils. Any help is greatly appreciated! __________________ Instagram - @edgarnator Last edited by conejodenieve; 05-20-2021 at 03:34 PM..
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05-20-2021, 03:32 PM	#2
exE36M3 BMW CCA Member 491 Rep 808 Posts Drives: 2015 435i M Sport Join Date: Jan 2018 Location: NorCal iTrader: (4)	So.... something to consider as I assume you have the adaptive suspension like I do. I recently just went back to the stock springs after one year of tinkering with my suspension. 1. Eibach pro-kit springs .8" drop front / Eibach sport springs rear .8" drop 2. Millway camber plates 3. Dinan shockware Not a coil set-up, but we are only talking .8" here which is pretty mild. So... what was the result of this project? GOOD 1. The Eibach springs got me to the drop I wanted... roughy 1 finger between tire and fender. Looked awesome. Good around the town, low-speed ride and handling. 2. Camber plates improved handling substantially - think 90mph+ on the tail of a '21 Vette on freeway flyover and he was too scared to accelerate away 3. Shock software put sport in comfort mode and sport+ in sport mode. So more firmer ride. BAD 1. With only .8" drop, adaptive shocks didn't response to abrupt road surfaces (think _---- or /––––\ ), so the front end would bottom out, as in tire rubbing the inside fender. At highway speeds, this was MORE apparent as our freeways and roads have some serious dips (those oil hotspots you see). 2. Camber plates... rattled (NOT ALL DO, but mine did) 3. Shockware helped with the bottoming out, but no enough. So back to stock height, stock adaptive shocks, stock springs... kept Dinan Shockware. The car is amazing with my 19x9-235/40 and 19x10-265/35 tires/wheels. No bottoming out, slight lean in turns. In my opinion, the stock adaptive shocks are programmed to function within a certain range and respond accordingly. Once you shorten that range (lowering the car), the software just doesn't know what to do. So the response isn't very good. I didn't go with the KW, Bilstein EDC compatible systems because it's still the same dilemma. The brain that controls the dampening system isn't on the shock, it's in the car. Others may chime in also, but from my experience - many people just code out the EDC (or run cancellers) and run the traditional suspension upgrades (spring/coil/adjustable shock). If I were to do it again, I'd buy compatible (car) coil-overs with adjustable shocks and code out the EDC. Last edited by exE36M3; 05-20-2021 at 03:37 PM..
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05-20-2021, 04:56 PM	#3
therealm3 Lieutenant Colonel 631 Rep 1,649 Posts Drives: F30 340 MSport Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: CA, USA iTrader: (7)	@exE36M3 - Interesting that you went back to stock height. I have been tinkering a bit too and lately have been thinking about going back to stock too. Or very close to it with a set of M3 springs I have. Like you said, the car just seemed to react to stuff better at that height. Who knows. I guess I could always switch back and all I am out is an alignment and my time. Hahaha. I really like how my car looks lowered but maybe this adaptive suspension just isn't cut out for it like you said. Did you keep the mono ball thrust arms too or go back to stock? I swapped stock ones back in chasing a rattle. Now I am on the fence of putting the mono ball back. It wasn't the source of my rattle but did eliminate a few buzzes I had on the interior. Lost some of that crisp steering n the process which is a bummer.
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05-20-2021, 05:17 PM	#4
conejodenieve Enlisted Member 49 Rep 30 Posts Drives: BMW 340i Join Date: Nov 2019 Location: California iTrader: (0)	So to respond to both of you guys, I have also thought about staying stock height and just replacing the shocks with OEM shocks. I really like the functionality of stock height but I'm sure the car would look nicer lowered. I just figured, since the OEM shocks are already super expensive, there had to be some good aftermarket solution for retaining the adaptive dampening. __________________ Instagram - @edgarnator
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05-20-2021, 06:00 PM	#5
M3exDeo Private First Class 191 Rep 150 Posts Drives: 2022 F97 X3M, 2011 E90 M3 Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Eastern PA iTrader: (1) Garage List 2022 BMW S1000R [0.00] 2022 F97 X3M [0.00] 2011 E90 M3 [0.00]	Just today I started researching adaptive suspension upgrades for my '13 335xi. I had to replace my front struts last August (only 2k miles ago!), and I'm about to do the rears. I really like the M adaptive suspension and I'd like to continue to use it, but I need/want to close up the wheel gap. I'm going to scan the F80 forum; I wonder if the F80 adaptive suspension is similar enough to compare users' experiences with the B16 and the KW DDC.
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05-20-2021, 09:01 PM	#7
Jvac Captain 438 Rep 787 Posts Drives: 2015 335i rwd Join Date: Jan 2019 Location: Usa iTrader: (1)	I think the adaptive suspension is overpriced and doesn't do a good job in comfort or sport mode. I have been running it for 3 years now and it just stinks. It can be coded out easily, and at that point you are free to run the suspension system of your choice. Otherwise, as the guys above have said, it won't be any better if you lower it and try to squeeze more performance out of it. It just doesn't have any more to give. And these other "ddc" or damptronic options aren't ideal either. They are made to fit a wide variety of 3 series cars and therefore they won't be optimized for any one in particular. You'll find they are too stiff, not stiff enough, or lacking in small, large, or small and large bump compliance. Leave it as is, or give up on adaptive altogether. __________________ 335i rwd auto, 2015 with m performance LSD and Dinan stage 2. Cts charge pipe, mad 5" stepped intercooler.
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05-20-2021, 11:16 PM	#8
exE36M3 BMW CCA Member 491 Rep 808 Posts Drives: 2015 435i M Sport Join Date: Jan 2018 Location: NorCal iTrader: (4)	The above proof, there is life after being lowered. The 235/40 and 265/35 enlarge the wheel diameter by .4" and .3" so it takes up some of the wheel gap while still giving some room between the road and rim. therealm3 - yeah, I pulled the Turner Monoballs out too. I did it chasing the camber plate rattle to no avail. The car rode so quietly without the monoball, I just left them off and sold them. The roads are so crappy around the Bay Area, we just need that suspension travel and some tire. (That and the F3X camber doesn't arc at all like previous BMWs so it's almost like, what's the point). The rattles, fender rub, noise, ride quality, etc. - ok when I was 20-ish. At 50... yeah, I'll take comfy and being able to drive at the limit with predictable control. But again, if you all find yourself driving around in Sport Mode because of the ride and why the car handles, the Dinan Shockware is pretty nice and cheap for $199 and 1/2 labor. @Jvac - yep. The issue really is how the EDC shocks are tuned. I'm actually kid of surprised there isn't a software upgrade for EDC like Bootmod3 or MDC for the motor. It's like +/- more rebound and +/- for jounce and maybe for drop. Last edited by exE36M3; 05-20-2021 at 11:24 PM..
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05-21-2021, 11:53 AM	#11
cfm56d7b Lieutenant General 5923 Rep 10,305 Posts Drives: 2017 440i Gran Coupe & 2015 X5 Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Orange County, CA iTrader: (2)	conejodenieve, my own situation is very similar to yours. My 2017 BMW 440i GC has M Adaptive suspension. BMW's M Adaptive suspension is good but but not exceptional. The rebound / compression cycles can be best described as lethargic. In Sport mode, the suspension bounces instead of rapidly absorbing road imperfection while maintaining the suspension geometry and contact with the road. My goals are identical to yours: - Maintain OEM suspension height - Retain OEM Comfort / Sport Mode functionality - Improve suspension behavior without compromising comfort (and that's where the choices are limited) After waiting for a long time for Bilstein B16 Damptronic coilovers, inability to maintain OEM suspension height became a barrier to purchase. So there are 2 more options from Bilstein: B4 Damptronic and B6 Damptronic shocks. Both B4 Damptonic and B6 Damptronic shocks can be used with OEM springs while maintaining OEM suspension height. B6 Damptronic is much stiffer in Sport mode, perhaps too stiff as reported be a fellow forum member: https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...TRONIC&page=11 So this leaves B4 Damptronic shocks as the only choice for now. Excellent article explaining the full range of Bilstein products: https://www.potn.co.uk/bilstein-range-explained/
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05-21-2021, 12:51 PM	#14
cfm56d7b Lieutenant General 5923 Rep 10,305 Posts Drives: 2017 440i Gran Coupe & 2015 X5 Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Orange County, CA iTrader: (2)	johnung, you are 100% correct. I am currently researching EDC implementation differences (if any) in B4 Damptronic and B6 Damptronic shocks. Will share my findings later.
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05-21-2021, 06:03 PM	#15
cfm56d7b Lieutenant General 5923 Rep 10,305 Posts Drives: 2017 440i Gran Coupe & 2015 X5 Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Orange County, CA iTrader: (2)	Just get a response from Bilstein. "There is no interpretation left up to the dampers, they are run by a program that the ECU controls." Makes sense since B4 Damptronic and B6 Damptronic functionality is controlled by the ECU software. Any performance differences are a result of the internal valving and other changes.
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05-22-2021, 09:12 AM	#16
435gc Lieutenant 174 Rep 461 Posts Drives: 2015 435i Gran Coupe xdrive Join Date: May 2019 Location: Charlotte iTrader: (0)	Would love to know if the b4 damptronic are an improvement over the stock edc
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05-22-2021, 10:48 AM	#19
exE36M3 BMW CCA Member 491 Rep 808 Posts Drives: 2015 435i M Sport Join Date: Jan 2018 Location: NorCal iTrader: (4)	therealm3 - No change with the position of the wheel with the Monoball Thrust arm. Caster remained the same. Admittedly, some of my issues were were offet + tire choice BUT, after tilting the camber to -2 to allow the wheel to tuck into the funder, it stopped rubbing the inside edge of the fender and started hitting the fender inside itself. :\ So yeah, the pairing of the EDC shock (even in Sport mode) with a progressive rate spring just didn't go so well.
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