[TiredGeek]

My car is coming up to 7k and I like to get the oil out before 9k to try to minimise the amount of metal floating around in there. It probably makes no difference but I'm an engineer and I just don't like the idea of first fill oil staying in there longer than that.

So, I've looked around and I need either 0w-30, 0w-40, 5w-30 or 5w-40. I'm thinking the 0w-40 or 5w-40 is better for long motorway runs but I can't find the 0w in BMW LL 04.
So 5w-40, but Castrol or Millers Nanodrive? Castrol is cheaper but if I was that worried about the cost I wouldn't have bought a 335 and I wouldn't be changing the oil now...…
I've always used Castrol in my previous cars and never had a problem but I've read good things about Millers so now I just don't know

Thoughts please gents


https://www.opieoils.co.uk/pv-99137-...20engine%20oil

https://www.opieoils.co.uk/pv-223208...20engine%20oil

[Wills2]

My thoughts are some very clever automotive engineers with the help of vast resources have already worked this out for you and recommended an oil grade and replacement cycle based upon millions of miles of testing in all conditions and backed that decision up with an unlimited mileage 3 year warranty.

I'd go with that as anything else is just guess work and anecdotal, my own anecdotal evidence over 500,000 miles is they are worth trusting.

[454697819]

Originally Posted by TiredGeek

My car is coming up to 7k and I like to get the oil out before 9k to try to minimise the amount of metal floating around in there. It probably makes no difference but I'm an engineer and I just don't like the idea of first fill oil staying in there longer than that.

So, I've looked around and I need either 0w-30, 0w-40, 5w-30 or 5w-40. I'm thinking the 0w-40 or 5w-40 is better for long motorway runs but I can't find the 0w in BMW LL 04.
So 5w-40, but Castrol or Millers Nanodrive? Castrol is cheaper but if I was that worried about the cost I wouldn't have bought a 335 and I wouldn't be changing the oil now...…
I've always used Castrol in my previous cars and never had a problem but I've read good things about Millers so now I just don't know

Thoughts please gents


https://www.opieoils.co.uk/pv-99137-...20engine%20oil

https://www.opieoils.co.uk/pv-223208...20engine%20oil

If like me you change your oil early then I don’t think it will make a vast difference to be honest! I choose to swap it out with genuine Bmw oil but that’s because my indie doesn’t want to put me at any risk with Bmw. When out of warranty I’ll probably go Castrol tbf

I have had three changes already ! Two independent and one Bmw - it always feels fresh afterwards :-)

[TiredGeek]

Cheers Wills2, I agree to a point.
While you change cars fairly frequently I prefer to stick with one I like for a good few years. BMW can warranty the car for 3 years unlimited miles and there's every probability the thing isn't going to go over 100k in that time, so frankly they don't care if it dies at 120k, whereas I'll be paying the bill if it does. For £200 to change the oil I'll have it done and consider it cheap insurance. It's not going to hurt the engine after all....

[adam.b]

shell is good oil, decent price on ECP with discount.

[Hooded]

Originally Posted by TiredGeek

Cheers Wills2, I agree to a point.
While you change cars fairly frequently I prefer to stick with one I like for a good few years. BMW can warranty the car for 3 years unlimited miles and there's every probability the thing isn't going to go over 100k in that time, so frankly they don't care if it dies at 120k, whereas I'll be paying the bill if it does. For £200 to change the oil I'll have it done and consider it cheap insurance. It's not going to hurt the engine after all....

I agree if you are keeping a car a long time it's a good idea not to go with the 18k oil changes and instead change the oil more often. Doesn't BMW recommend oil changes every 10k miles on these engines over in the states anyway? Must be a reason for that.

[Eddamoo]

Home bargains sell 5w30 LL04 oil for 16£ per 4.5L.

I have gallons of the stuff and always perform an interim suction oil change on mine and the Mrs car.

[Wills2]

o

Originally Posted by TiredGeek

Cheers Wills2, I agree to a point.
While you change cars fairly frequently I prefer to stick with one I like for a good few years. BMW can warranty the car for 3 years unlimited miles and there's every probability the thing isn't going to go over 100k in that time, so frankly they don't care if it dies at 120k, whereas I'll be paying the bill if it does. For £200 to change the oil I'll have it done and consider it cheap insurance. It's not going to hurt the engine after all....

I've got a 12 year old BMW sat on the drive that I've had from new and I use the same procedure and again to my amazement they seem to know what they're doing.

Whether it's an M3 doing 30k per year or a 12 year old Z4 3.0 coupe doing 4k per year I use the schedule and oil grade and it works.

It's no insurance at all, but hey it's your money.

[bishbosh]

I currently have Fuchs xtl c3 5w30 in my 335d which is bmw approved. Used this not long after I bought the car in October.

My last car was an e91 320d with the dreaded timing chain issue. Fortunately I had a lot of preventative work done under warranty before the chain snapped (it was making a horrible racket). Anyway to minimise the risk of future issues and for the sake of £50 at a time I changed the oil every 8k miles. I've never believed engines run better with extended service intervals and it's more to keep fleet buyers happy.

I used Fuchs titan xtl 5w40 as the car was getting a bit leggy. Sold it eventually at 204k miles and the engine was still running sweet.

My 2 penneth

[Soul_Glo]

Liqui moly here. Expensive but quality stuff.

https://torqueblock.com/blogs/blog/liqui-moly-molygen

[FarmerD]

Originally Posted by Wills2

o

I've got a 12 year old BMW sat on the drive that I've had from new and I use the same procedure and again to my amazement they seem to know what they're doing.

Whether it's an M3 doing 30k per year or a 12 year old Z4 3.0 coupe doing 4k per year I use the schedule and oil grade and it works.

It's no insurance at all, but hey it's your money.

Same for me here - 110k mile 2013 330d and 76k mile 2007 Z4 coupe both serviced to schedule and no issues. I get the concern but I’m not convinced that the benefits of over servicing are enough, unless you give your car a hard time in which case it makes sense.

My dad has always run cars from new for as long as he can. His 2004 Octavia 19.tdi bought from new and now with 170k miles has only ever been serviced to plan, and has been v reliable.

[1966-TR4]

I would ask the frequent oil changers of modern cars this - after you change the oil, what are you doing to get it circulated, filter "primed", before starting it up?

Probably nothing, which means that after each of those oil changes, you have an increased period of running with zero or very little pressure, compared to a normal startup.

Personally I would prefer to minimise those scenarios, and trust the service schedule.

On my classics, which had oil changes sometimes as often as every 6k, I would have the spark plugs out, disconnect the fuel hose, open the throttle by hand, and spin the engine over via a solenoid in the engine bay. This filled the filter, circulated the oil and got pressure up - which unlike a modern, I could see on the gauge - with no combustion and very little compression.

If you have ever had one or more big end bearings fail as I did on the GT6, which suffered badly from a previous owner's original fitment of filters with no anti-drain valve, you will understand my caution! Each to their own though.

This isn't Ol' Timer stuff, I was last doing this 4 or 5 years ago in my early 40s.

[bishbosh]

Originally Posted by 1966-TR4

I would ask the frequent oil changers of modern cars this - after you change the oil, what are you doing to get it circulated, filter "primed", before starting it up?

Probably nothing, which means that after each of those oil changes, you have an increased period of running with zero or very little pressure, compared to a normal startup.

How do you work that out? Oil circulates in the same way it would normally.
The filter doesn't hold that much oil.

[1966-TR4]

Originally Posted by bishbosh

How do you work that out? Oil circulates in the same way it would normally.
The filter doesn't hold that much oil.

If the filter is empty, oil is not immediately available to the bearings on startup.

Why do you think filters have anti-drain back valves? When you remove the filter, and by extension the anti-drain back valve, galleries in the engine that would ordinarily remain primed to some extent, will empty.

[RENT-A-GOAT]

Mines a 320d I service to BMW schedule Rybrook Warwick I was told they use the BMW Spec CASTROL 0w30 in all apart from the specific models which require different M cars etc. So I have a 1ltr top up bottle in the boot in an oil pouch at all times just incase. I did exactly the same with my E91.

[bishbosh]

Bearings will have an oil film on them even after the engine has been stood awhile and the filter will recharge quickly anyway, within a second or so.

Personally I'd counter that stop/start has more of a detrimental effect on engine wear than twice yearly oil changes.

[1966-TR4]

Originally Posted by bishbosh

Bearings will have an oil film on them even after the engine has been stood awhile and the filter will recharge quickly anyway, within a second or so.

Personally I'd counter that stop/start has more of a detrimental effect on engine wear than twice yearly oil changes.

When the big end bearings went on my GT6, it was because of the use of filters with no anti drain back. Which meant the filter was empty on start and there was no pressure in the system. The pressure, whether by full filter or anti drain back, is what causes pressurised oil to be held in the engine galleries, so it is not just about the amount of oil in the filter. Have you ever noticed, after emptying the sump, how you get a sudden additional rush of oil out the sump when you unscrew the filter?

Obviously on that car there were many more dry starts like this than someone who is doing a twice yearly oil change. But the fact is that it does cause damage. The tighter clearances on a modern engine probably reduce the scope for damage though.

[Gorsh]

Originally Posted by TiredGeek

My car is coming up to 7k and I like to get the oil out before 9k to try to minimise the amount of metal floating around in there. It probably makes no difference but I'm an engineer and I just don't like the idea of first fill oil staying in there longer than that.

So, I've looked around and I need either 0w-30, 0w-40, 5w-30 or 5w-40. I'm thinking the 0w-40 or 5w-40 is better for long motorway runs but I can't find the 0w in BMW LL 04.
So 5w-40, but Castrol or Millers Nanodrive? Castrol is cheaper but if I was that worried about the cost I wouldn't have bought a 335 and I wouldn't be changing the oil now...…
I've always used Castrol in my previous cars and never had a problem but I've read good things about Millers so now I just don't know

Thoughts please gents

Hi, I can understand how you feel about changing the oil - I was a mechanic (technician now!) in my youth and I'm now the wrong side of 60 so I remember those days of mineral oils and engines built to less exacting standards than modern cars.
I don't bother changing my BMW oil any more often than scheduled but if you feel you must do it then I would strongly recommend using whatever oil your BMW dealer would use - then they have no grounds to blame the oil should something go wrong with the engine - get a filter from them too rather than a generic one.

[Steve_M_Sport]

I supplied 7l of Shell Helix oil to Sytner Nottingham and the service chap said that was exactly the same oil as they supplied for an extra £100. That’s good enough for my 335D .

[TiredGeek]

Ooooooh, I hadn't realised this was such a contentious issue!

Right, my reasons.
My old Volvo (2007 XC70 D5) was an 18k / 12 month oil change with full synthetic 0w-30 oil. I did the first oil and filter at 8k and then after at each 12 month service. Got any crap out of there from the running in period. Volvo had a 60k / 3 year warranty. I did 126k with zero engine issues. Hundreds of other expensive problems but that's another story.
They say that the Haldex AWD unit is sealed for life and does not need servicing, ever. Audi say the exact same unit needs it's oil changing every 25k miles. Who's right there?
Volvo also say the auto gearbox is sealed for life etc. They regularly fail around 120k. Change the gearbox oil at 30k and every 50k after and it has no problems, but I suppose that's just a coincidence as the Volvo designers clearly know more than Borg Warner who recommend the above oil changes and actually make the gearbox.
Of course, by the time they fail they're well out of warranty and Volvo tell you to suck it up, £1800 for the Haldex and £4500 for the gearbox, plus fitting.

If you want to follow BMW recommendations and you've had no problems, then I applaud you, and wish you luck.
I'm firmly in the camp of I don't trust cost cutting exercises by extending oil change intervals, trusting that BMW care enough to worry what will happen once the car is out of warranty and not their problem, I'm having the f*@£&@g oil changed, it is my money after all and if I want to spend a few quid chucking good oil down the drain then so be it...….I'm sorry if this upsets people.

Now, back on topic: Castrol, Millers or Shell

[DriveS]

I change mine once per year or every 8K. Have done this on all my turbo cars.

I use the BMW spec LL04, usually castrol. If this makes a difference, I dont know. Peace of mind I suppose.

However I often wonder why is there a need to put Long Life oil in if I am changing it so often. Maybe the LL oil is compromised in some way and a shorter life oil changing more regular would be better. Any thoughts on this?

[Eddamoo]

Originally Posted by 1966-TR4

I would ask the frequent oil changers of modern cars this - after you change the oil, what are you doing to get it circulated, filter "primed", before starting it up?

Probably nothing, which means that after each of those oil changes, you have an increased period of running with zero or very little pressure, compared to a normal startup.

Personally I would prefer to minimise those scenarios, and trust the service schedule.

On my classics, which had oil changes sometimes as often as every 6k, I would have the spark plugs out, disconnect the fuel hose, open the throttle by hand, and spin the engine over via a solenoid in the engine bay. This filled the filter, circulated the oil and got pressure up - which unlike a modern, I could see on the gauge - with no combustion and very little compression.

If you have ever had one or more big end bearings fail as I did on the GT6, which suffered badly from a previous owner's original fitment of filters with no anti-drain valve, you will understand my caution! Each to their own though.

This isn't Ol' Timer stuff, I was last doing this 4 or 5 years ago in my early 40s.

I've serviced all my own cars from a 1933 Austin to the 4 series - probably about 15. I've never seen a car that keeps its oil system 'Primed'? Gravity does it's work very quickly which is why the film strength of oil is so important. I'd much rather have clean oil for 2 possibly dryer revolutions than borderline sludge for a million!

I do drive a diesel however and I'm an "if it's not broke, fix it anyway" kinda person!