[Vinc3]

Hi Guys,

I'm about to go to JF Automotive in Maidstone Kent for a remap however I'm not sure whether to get the full 750nm/550 ft/lb map or have the peak torque limited to 700nm/516 ft/lb in order to comply with ZF's advised gearbox peak torque limit.

I called ZF and spoke to them directly and the engineer that I spoke to said that the GA8HP70X gearbox has a max torque handling of 700nm/516 ft/lb, anything above that will cause the valves to dry out. He didn't say how long the box would have to receive above 700nm+ of torque before that happens, so I'm fairly sure that the boxes can take more power than 700nm as no manufacturer would tell the max handling limit on how much their products can handle otherwise people like me who like messing around with their cars would be pushing their cars to the limits and breaking them, and that wouldn't be good press for the manufacturers who would definitely be considering the aftermarket tuning scene when they manufacture their products as far as over-engineering goes. I've not heard any stories about the ZF boxes breaking with a 750nm/550ft/lb map on it...?

So my question to you guys is: -

Who's got a 750nm/550ft/lb map on their car?

Who's had any issues with this?

How many miles have you done?

Based on this information for the life longevity of my rather expensive and nice car, I'm tempted to go for the 700nm map but ask for the map to hold the 700nm for as long as possible without dropping off, however the boost junkie in me will be wanting 750nm

[Hooded]

I can't answer your question but my advice would be depends how long you intend keeping the car. If you plan to change It in a couple of years I would probably risk going over 700nm but certainly not above 750nm. If you plan keeping the car say another 3 - 5 years I would stick with around 700nm
Cheers

[Tengocity]

I had a 700NM map for 18 months (independently verified at the last forum dyno meet), but last summer had to get the remap re-installed after some warranty work. That time around I just went with the standard DMS one which is over 700NM. I've done about 40k miles on the first map and another 25k since the most recent one. I'm not sure exactly what torque it has now, though will find out next weekend when it goes down to Surrey Rolling Road.

No gearbox issues so far (92k miles), though I did get the gearbox oil changed at 65k miles as a precaution. I'm intending to keep the car for another couple of years and not particularly concerned.

If I'm honest 700NM felt great and if I've got more now it doesn't make the car feel any better than before, so part of me wishes i'd stuck with my previous map, just for that little peace of mind as I get towards 100k miles.

[Vinc3]

Hey Tengocity, thanks for the information, much appreciated.

I think that a lot of any reliability issues will depend on how you drive the car, in that if you rag it when it's cold or thrash it about a lot you're asking for trouble with or without a remap. It's good to hear that you've been running remaps with no issues.

What I'm really after is the increased drive-ability and throttle response in comfort mode as it's a pain in the arse keep putting it in and out of comfort/sport mode and I'm rubbish at driving in the semi-auto mode I guess that if the throttle response is going to be improved with the remap in comfort mode that you get the best of both worlds so 700nm will suffice.

Is there a group going to Surrey RR? and will you guys be posting your dyno results as I'm definitely interested in seeing these.

Cheers,

Vince

[JLR1969]

Originally Posted by Vinc3

Hey Tengocity, thanks for the information, much appreciated.

I think that a lot of any reliability issues will depend on how you drive the car, in that if you rag it when it's cold or thrash it about a lot you're asking for trouble with or without a remap. It's good to hear that you've been running remaps with no issues.

What I'm really after is the increased drive-ability and throttle response in comfort mode as it's a pain in the arse keep putting it in and out of comfort/sport mode and I'm rubbish at driving in the semi-auto mode I guess that if the throttle response is going to be improved with the remap in comfort mode that you get the best of both worlds so 700nm will suffice.

Is there a group going to Surrey RR? and will you guys be posting your dyno results as I'm definitely interested in seeing these.

Cheers,

Vince

Quite a few going to the RR Day with mapped 335s so the results will be published.

Why not come along and run your car as there is a spare place

[Tengocity]

Originally Posted by Vinc3

Hey Tengocity, thanks for the information, much appreciated.

I think that a lot of any reliability issues will depend on how you drive the car, in that if you rag it when it's cold or thrash it about a lot you're asking for trouble with or without a remap. It's good to hear that you've been running remaps with no issues.

What I'm really after is the increased drive-ability and throttle response in comfort mode as it's a pain in the arse keep putting it in and out of comfort/sport mode and I'm rubbish at driving in the semi-auto mode I guess that if the throttle response is going to be improved with the remap in comfort mode that you get the best of both worlds so 700nm will suffice.

Is there a group going to Surrey RR? and will you guys be posting your dyno results as I'm definitely interested in seeing these.

Cheers,

Vince

I'd hoped the same as you but if I'm honest the throttle response in comfort is still a little soft, and I still spend a lot of time in sport mode. What I also wanted was overtaking punch and autobahn performance in the 100mph+ range and the first remap gave me everything I wanted in that regard.

I agree about longevity being related to how it's used, and I try to let the car warm up properly, I don't do LC starts. But I have done track days and plenty hard driving!

I'm sure there will be full reports from the Dyno day!

[Vinc3]

Originally Posted by JLR1969

Quite a few going to the RR Day with mapped 335s so the results will be published.

Why not come along and run your car as there is a spare place

Thanks for the invite JLR... When is it, how much etc?

I'm not sure that it's worth me going down with my car as is as it's currently standard and I'm not booked in for the remap until 3rd June plus John from JF Automotive will be giving me a dyno printout when he does the remap so that I can publish it on this forum for comparison with other maps from the likes of DMS/Ecotune etc... Although if I'm free and the Wife hasn't made us any plans I might pop down to meet some new like-minded folk

Originally Posted by tengocity

I'd hoped the same as you but if I'm honest the throttle response in comfort is still a little soft, and I still spend a lot of time in sport mode. What I also wanted was overtaking punch and autobahn performance in the 100mph+ range and the first remap gave me everything I wanted in that regard.

Does the new map not give the same throttle response etc as your first 700nm map?

I presume that you didn't get a dyno printout with the DMS map?

Do you have a copy of your 700nm map to compare? Would be interesting to see a comparison between the 2.

[Tengocity]

Both remaps are same regarding throttle characteristics. I do have the dyno readout from the first remap and will have the new one next saturday. I too will be interested to see the difference.

[JLR1969]

Originally Posted by Vinc3

Thanks for the invite JLR... When is it, how much etc?

I'm not sure that it's worth me going down with my car as is as it's currently standard and I'm not booked in for the remap until 3rd June plus John from JF Automotive will be giving me a dyno printout when he does the remap so that I can publish it on this forum for comparison with other maps from the likes of DMS/Ecotune etc... Although if I'm free and the Wife hasn't made us any plans I might pop down to meet some new like-minded folk



Does the new map not give the same throttle response etc as your first 700nm map?

I presume that you didn't get a dyno printout with the DMS map?

Do you have a copy of your 700nm map to compare? Would be interesting to see a comparison between the 2.

It's a week on Saturday so the 13th May cost is £35 but have a look on the thread about it.

Be good to know what your car is pushing out pre map as a comparison

[Ajs_435d]

Comparing rolling road results is a bit pointless from one of rolling road to another. Far too many factors and parameters not the same.

[Hooded]

Originally Posted by Ajs_435d

Comparing rolling road results is a bit pointless from one of rolling road to another. Far too many factors and parameters not the same.

Agree, .. and it does also help to have stock version of the car to get a baseline reading before testing the tuned cars. Using the correct gear for the test on these cars is very important, 3rd gear on these F series cars is usually the most accurate and if the dyno is accurate you should find the stock car is within 5% of the Bmw quoted power when testing in 3rd gear. You should then use the same gear to test the tuned cars to get a more accurate and realistic power reading.

[Tengocity]

Originally Posted by Ajs_435d

Comparing rolling road results is a bit pointless from one of rolling road to another. Far too many factors and parameters not the same.

I'll be comparing the same car on the same dyno, presumably with the same operator, so just ambient conditions will vary hopefully.

[Red F30]

Did you get the remap done from JF Automotive? I'm curious to see if they're any good.

[Vinc3]

Originally Posted by Red F30

Did you get the remap done from JF Automotive? I'm curious to see if they're any good.

Booked in for this Saturday morning, I'll post the dyno result when I get it and let you know how the map feels

[Dandanbmw]

Originally Posted by Vinc3

Booked in for this Saturday morning, I'll post the dyno result when I get it and let you know how the map feels

Hi mate I had my 640d remapped at JF Automotive which was 360bhp & 750nm - 550lbs ft and it was spot on for the 17k miles I put on the car while it was remapped.
I also went to a Surrey rolling road day and it produced 360bhp & 550lbs ft so pretty spot on. I voiced my concerns about going over 700nm and John said it will be fine and it can handle it no problem.

[Darth Helmut]

Vinc3 , would be good if you could join the crowd at the Surrey RR day.

I got 738Nm (545lb/ft) and 348 bhp with a Bluespark Pro+ Boost box on my 435d on the May meet. I try to limit the amount of times Im at the upper end of the torque curve. I use DashCommand OBD app tied to an Android tablet to monitor it (the default sport gauges still only have stock power/tq values).

[Dandanfings]

Originally Posted by Darth Helmut

Vinc3 , would be good if you could join the crowd at the Surrey RR day.

I got 738Nm (545lb/ft) and 348 bhp with a Bluespark Pro+ Boost box on my 435d on the May meet. I try to limit the amount of times Im at the upper end of the torque curve. I use DashCommand OBD app tied to an Android tablet to monitor it (the default sport gauges still only have stock power/tq values).

When is that?

[Vinc3]

Originally Posted by Darth Helmut

Vinc3 , would be good if you could join the crowd at the Surrey RR day.

I got 738Nm (545lb/ft) and 348 bhp with a Bluespark Pro+ Boost box on my 435d on the May meet. I try to limit the amount of times Im at the upper end of the torque curve. I use DashCommand OBD app tied to an Android tablet to monitor it (the default sport gauges still only have stock power/tq values).

Hopefully I'll be there to meet some of you guys... I think that I put down for Saturday the 12th August on my poll vote, although I'm not that fussed about getting the dyno done as John @ JF Automotive is doing a dyno run for me tomorrow so that I can post it on the forum for other people to see.

I think that JF Automotive should be put on the map a little bit more if they're good as there aren't any WELL KNOWN tuning companies in the South East... Previously I drove to P-Torque in Wolverhampton and after that bought a DPF delete kit and iFlash from Ecotune. It's good to have someone local.

Exciting!

I'm fairly confident that the cars can handle the 750nm... Otherwise we'd be seeing lots of horror stories and the tuning companies would reduce their mapping to 700nm.

[markoroogo]

Originally Posted by Tengocity

I had a 700NM map for 18 months (independently verified at the last forum dyno meet), but last summer had to get the remap re-installed after some warranty work. That time around I just went with the standard DMS one which is over 700NM. I've done about 40k miles on the first map and another 25k since the most recent one. I'm not sure exactly what torque it has now, though will find out next weekend when it goes down to Surrey Rolling Road.

No gearbox issues so far (92k miles), though I did get the gearbox oil changed at 65k miles as a precaution. I'm intending to keep the car for another couple of years and not particularly concerned.

If I'm honest 700NM felt great and if I've got more now it doesn't make the car feel any better than before, so part of me wishes i'd stuck with my previous map, just for that little peace of mind as I get towards 100k miles.

Do you get any smoke from your DMS remap?

[Ajs_435d]

I'm running 374/550 on very accurate dyno no problems for 7 months.

[markoroogo]

I've had no problems as such but it does kick out some smoke when pressing on. Not sure if I need to be worried.

[Dandanfings]

Originally Posted by markoroogo

I've had no problems as such but it does kick out some smoke when pressing on. Not sure if I need to be worried.

Not really a massive worry but it means the map is a bit poor as they added too much fuel.
May get DPF issues later :s

My identical twins 35d makes no smoke.