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M2 Technical Topics > Track / Autocross / Dragstrip > Road Atlanta this weekend anyone?

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      11-15-2016, 09:32 PM   #1
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Road Atlanta this weekend anyone?

Taking my 99M3 and not my M2 as the drive from Chicago is too long and don't want to put that many miles on it. Regardless, wondering if anyone is going?
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      11-22-2016, 07:35 PM   #2
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1 AW M2 at the event. Talked to the guy but he is not on this forum.

This event was run by MVP who I have run with many times before. I ran advanced at Road America earlier this year with them and was amongst the slower cars because most of that run group was very high horsepower cars like newer vettes, GT3s or pure race cars. I signed up for the intermediate group at Road Atlanta mostly because I was running my E36 M3 which has very little power. Even that run group was dominated by high horsepower cars making the M2 middle of the pack at best. As fast and fun as the M2 is it's difficult to run with some of these outfits who cater to the very fast high power cars.
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      11-23-2016, 07:27 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyrat 2 View Post
1 AW M2 at the event. Talked to the guy but he is not on this forum.

This event was run by MVP who I have run with many times before. I ran advanced at Road America earlier this year with them and was amongst the slower cars because most of that run group was very high horsepower cars like newer vettes, GT3s or pure race cars. I signed up for the intermediate group at Road Atlanta mostly because I was running my E36 M3 which has very little power. Even that run group was dominated by high horsepower cars making the M2 middle of the pack at best. As fast and fun as the M2 is it's difficult to run with some of these outfits who cater to the very fast high power cars.
I will be running my M2 at Road Atlanta this weekend with Chin. I used to run advanced/red with all groups, like MVP, Chin, etc. in my C5Z modded track car. At RA, and especially with Chin, you find a lot of full blown race cars plus a lot of very fast street cars like GT3s, GTRs....so I would run mid pack. I am sure that I will be dropping into the intermediate/blue group in the M2. I have already tested it at RA and know it's about 5-6 seconds slower....but it is a lot more fun and predictable.
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      12-07-2016, 10:02 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by Pyrat 2 View Post
1 AW M2 at the event. Talked to the guy but he is not on this forum.

This event was run by MVP who I have run with many times before. I ran advanced at Road America earlier this year with them and was amongst the slower cars because most of that run group was very high horsepower cars like newer vettes, GT3s or pure race cars. I signed up for the intermediate group at Road Atlanta mostly because I was running my E36 M3 which has very little power. Even that run group was dominated by high horsepower cars making the M2 middle of the pack at best. As fast and fun as the M2 is it's difficult to run with some of these outfits who cater to the very fast high power cars.

Might I humbly suggest you attend a BMW CCA HPDE


High hp cars are definitely available on the market and there appear to be plenty of new drivers out there in them as well.

Indeed they definitely are beginning to dominate tracks with long straights like COTA, Road America, road Atlanta.

These days,showing up on street tires with 365 hp is underpowered vs the 500-600hp exotics that show up at high hp. tracks.

As a chief instructor I am often finding that I am advising " A " group level drivers in cars like the E36 M3 and even stockish E46 M3 to run in the " B " group so that they will not spend the entire day checking their mirror for faster cars.
I recently gave this same story to a national autocross champion that was in an S2000. Excellent driver. Car was just overmatched at COTA with a top speed of 125 mph. A stock 1M or M2 will top reach 145-150, and supercars are at 160-165. Compared to an E36 M3.. That's a 30 mph difference !!

A lot of people are initially upset and take it as an ego hit .. but once they've experienced the closing rate ( particularly under braking ) of cars on the back straight they understand
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      12-07-2016, 12:11 PM   #5
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Started with and still run with BMWCCA. Not enough events available in my proximity plus frankly they in general treat most like beginners even if they have been driving at HPDEs. Not trying to create a debate. Just my feeling. On the flip side you are correct. I'm rarely outperformed by a huge margin.
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      12-07-2016, 07:59 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Pyrat 2 View Post
Started with and still run with BMWCCA. Not enough events available in my proximity plus frankly they in general treat most like beginners even if they have been driving at HPDEs. Not trying to create a debate. Just my feeling. On the flip side you are correct. I'm rarely outperformed by a huge margin.
I have moved to the blue/intermediate group with Chin in my M2 for now...it is very competitive....but the big dogs in red are neo race cars . I am certain that it would run in the front of the advanced group in BMWCCA. Problem is that I refuse to put up with their BS and avoid their events at RA.They give instructors two students , which is exhausting and unsafe. They will not allow instructors to give rides in their own cars to others,even other instructors...the list goes on. I don't know if this is a local issue or national, but they have lost me and many others as participants.
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      12-08-2016, 07:42 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Twt View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyrat 2 View Post
Started with and still run with BMWCCA. Not enough events available in my proximity plus frankly they in general treat most like beginners even if they have been driving at HPDEs. Not trying to create a debate. Just my feeling. On the flip side you are correct. I'm rarely outperformed by a huge margin.
I have moved to the blue/intermediate group with Chin in my M2 for now...it is very competitive....but the big dogs in red are neo race cars . I am certain that it would run in the front of the advanced group in BMWCCA. Problem is that I refuse to put up with their BS and avoid their events at RA.They give instructors two students , which is exhausting and unsafe. They will not allow instructors to give rides in their own cars to others,even other instructors...the list goes on. I don't know if this is a local issue or national, but they have lost me and many others as participants.
Sorry I'm on my phone so can't see which RA you are referring to. I've been to BMW CCA events at BOTH.

Road Atlanta is my favorite track. I've instructed for peachtree there on three occasions but haven't made it back in the 1M and a lot can change in 5 years.

Road America is absolutely awesome. I've been to the area 4-5 times and also attended BMW CCA ofest - that location is probably the best venue across the country for Ofest. - but I digress !

Most BMW CCA schools encourage instructors to give rides. I'm very surprised to see this policy and if it is correct as you indicate that's a local CDI making that decision.

As a matter of fact there were mandatory " instructor ride " sessions at BMW CCA events I have attended at Watkins Glen and also at High Plains raceway (Rocky mountain chapter ) in which instructors take their assigned student(s) out.

In my opinion, It's absolutely educational for a student to ride with an instructor ( especially if the instructor drives the students vehicle and can demonstrate what the vehicle can do at an eight or nine/tenths pace ) in order for many students to make some of the mental conceptual leaps needed (!oh wow you want me to brake *that *hard .... etc ).

Each track in the country has different challenges, but i would hope that instructors are sharing seats with other instructors as well as students in order to foster better learning. I've been to 15 different tracks around the country. If I go to an event and it's my first time there , the first thing I'm gonna do is give up my first session of driving (if necessary) so I can ride with an instructor to be shown " the line " as well as get any tips from a local on the course.


@twt 2 - Unfortunately I don't share your opinion having two students is " unsafe".

I am sure we can probably both agree that It would definitely be unsafe in having two students on the track that need an instructor and to only give one of those two students an instructor .

If and when I assign instructors to more than a single student I always try to take care to ensure that both students are not absolutely new to the sport. At my events we endeavor to create a schedule that does not have an instructor in a car in sessions back to back as That can be very challenging!


@pyrat2

Without debating the merits of each chapter - thanks for your continued support of the local chapter and just a reminder to all that even if you have issues with your home area chapters - don't give up on all of BMW CCA events when you road trip!
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      12-08-2016, 09:31 PM   #8
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Thanks for the thoughtful reply....I was referring to Road Atlanta. As to the second point, we do run back to back to back....student, student, advanced.etc. I find that I am incapable of keeping up the pace and providing my full attention to my students. When I instruct with one student, I not only ride with them every green session, but also try to give them a few rides in my session plus off track time between sessions to talk....this kind of attention is necessary to introduce the Novice to the hobby, but can't be done properly with multiple students. The unsafe part comes from the fatigue I feel at the end of each day coupled with the fact that the student is given less than optimal attention and feedback.
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      12-08-2016, 09:49 PM   #9
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M3Adjuster, have you been to North East tracks (LCMT, Calabogie or CTMP)?
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      12-09-2016, 04:12 PM   #10
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M3Adjuster, have you been to North East tracks (LCMT, Calabogie or CTMP)?
I've been to Watkins Glen.. (full course) but that is probably the only NE track .. I've also been to Mid Ohio Car Course but I don't count that as being really north east.. When I went to Watkins it was 24 hrs of driving to get home


I would love to make a long trip to do Calabogie, and Mosport (CTMP is way too long a name for me plus I'm old school!) and Trois Rivere or Mont Tremblant. All are a LOOONG way from TX so I would want to try and make a trip where I could do one or more of the three in a few weeks. If you see any BMW CCA events back to back or within 3 weeks like that.. shoot me a PM!
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      12-09-2016, 10:44 PM   #11
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I've been to Watkins Glen.. (full course) but that is probably the only NE track .. I've also been to Mid Ohio Car Course but I don't count that as being really north east.. When I went to Watkins it was 24 hrs of driving to get home


I would love to make a long trip to do Calabogie, and Mosport (CTMP is way too long a name for me plus I'm old school!) and Trois Rivere or Mont Tremblant. All are a LOOONG way from TX so I would want to try and make a trip where I could do one or more of the three in a few weeks. If you see any BMW CCA events back to back or within 3 weeks like that.. shoot me a PM!
Sure, it is a possibility, as in addition to the local BMWCCA chapters (Trillium, Ottawa and Quebec chapters) holding events at the local tracks, non-local BMWCC clubs also hold events (e.g. BMWCC Boston holds a 3-day event at Tremblant every year). Calabogie, Tremblant and Mosport are top 3 of the region. Great elevation changes, blind corners, decreasing radius curves, off camber curves, carousel. All very different with unique flavours

Indeed Texas is quite far!
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