BMW
X1 / X2
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
BIMMERPOST Universal Forums Off-Topic Discussions Board Are there any architects on here?

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      09-21-2022, 11:19 PM   #1
whyzee125
Colonel
936
Rep
2,595
Posts

Drives: Dinan stage 2 335i
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Chattanooga Tn

iTrader: (0)

Are there any architects on here?

I'm going to be building a house this year and I'm having a heck of a time finding a good architect.

You've probably seen me rant before that literally nobody can do anything right in my area and I'm once again finding this to be true. I can barely get anyone to answer the phone, let alone not lose my file, remember our appointments, and I've not yet gotten even one to get to the actual next step phase.

I don't want to have to beg someone repeatedly to call me back who is not eager to do the job that I'm paying them for. I'm ready to get someone out of state. Anyone on here do this for a living or know of one?
Appreciate 1
vreihen169824.00
      09-22-2022, 10:48 AM   #2
chassis
Lieutenant Colonel
chassis's Avatar
United_States
3635
Rep
1,626
Posts

Drives: BMW G01 X3, M-B GLE350W4
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: midwest

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
You’re contemplating to build a house in three months and haven’t engaged an architect yet? Is this the correct understanding?

In your phone conversations, have you asked, “I want to pay you for a set of plans. Are you available for this project?”

Because of your tight timing, you have a general contractor engaged under contract, correct? Have you asked him/her for an architect referral?
Appreciate 0
      09-22-2022, 11:26 AM   #3
whyzee125
Colonel
936
Rep
2,595
Posts

Drives: Dinan stage 2 335i
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Chattanooga Tn

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by chassis View Post
Youíre contemplating to build a house in three months and havenít engaged an architect yet? Is this the correct understanding?

In your phone conversations, have you asked, ďI want to pay you for a set of plans. Are you available for this project?Ē

Because of your tight timing, you have a general contractor engaged under contract, correct? Have you asked him/her for an architect referral?
I meant within the next year. I only bought the land about 2 months ago but it's cleared and ready to go. I've picked a builder but I'm not under a contract with him yet.

Yes, that's exactly how I started each conversation. I've probably tried with 10+ firms and I can't get anyone to move forward. Everyone who replies says they would like to do it, but then they ghost me or forget about our appointment, etc.
Appreciate 0
      09-22-2022, 11:39 AM   #4
gatorfast
Major General
gatorfast's Avatar
United_States
4543
Rep
6,723
Posts

Drives: 718 Cayman
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: SoFla

iTrader: (4)

My friend Art Vandelay is an architect
Appreciate 1
F30lolz6363.50
      09-22-2022, 11:41 AM   #5
whyzee125
Colonel
936
Rep
2,595
Posts

Drives: Dinan stage 2 335i
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Chattanooga Tn

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gatorfast View Post
My friend Art Vandelay is an architect
That's the one I want to use! Lol
Appreciate 0
      09-22-2022, 12:17 PM   #6
NYG
Colonel
NYG's Avatar
United_States
7205
Rep
2,910
Posts

Drives: Corvette Z06
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Brooklyn, NY

iTrader: (0)

Things work differently from state to state and all the firms I work with won't do anything that isn't high-rise commercial/residential unless you're willing to pay 500x the price.

Some tips that can help:

1) Find a structural engineer first and ask for a recommendation
2) Find a general contractor and ask for a recommendation
3) Drive by any development in progress and ask the foreman who the RA on the project is - you may run into a cunt but for the most part they shouldn't have a problem sharing

Here are design firms in Chattanooga:

https://www.surfacearch.com/
https://www.hkarchitects.net/

If you're going with any structure that isn't timber (steel, masonry, prolly not concrete but who knows) - I can help you on the structural side.

Last edited by NYG; 09-22-2022 at 12:32 PM..
Appreciate 1
whyzee125935.50
      09-22-2022, 12:51 PM   #7
Bking60
Private
19
Rep
56
Posts

Drives: BMW X5 2019
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Mt Pleasant SC

iTrader: (0)

We had a house plan designer do it on autocad. I drew in the beam locations and the lumber supplier had the LVL dealer look it over. He beefed it up for CYA. The bank wanted the whole package but agreed to skip electrical plans since I was doing the entire electrical. They were adamant on having house elevations.
This was in a different county.
Appreciate 0
      09-22-2022, 01:54 PM   #8
chassis
Lieutenant Colonel
chassis's Avatar
United_States
3635
Rep
1,626
Posts

Drives: BMW G01 X3, M-B GLE350W4
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: midwest

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
whyzee125 what kind of structure are you thinking of? A garden shed or something grander?

Simple set of plans can be had on the internet. What is the reason for the architect?
Appreciate 0
      09-22-2022, 08:27 PM   #9
whyzee125
Colonel
936
Rep
2,595
Posts

Drives: Dinan stage 2 335i
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Chattanooga Tn

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by NYG View Post
Things work differently from state to state and all the firms I work with won't do anything that isn't high-rise commercial/residential unless you're willing to pay 500x the price.

Some tips that can help:

1) Find a structural engineer first and ask for a recommendation
2) Find a general contractor and ask for a recommendation
3) Drive by any development in progress and ask the foreman who the RA on the project is - you may run into a cunt but for the most part they shouldn't have a problem sharing

Here are design firms in Chattanooga:

https://www.surfacearch.com/
https://www.hkarchitects.net/

If you're going with any structure that isn't timber (steel, masonry, prolly not concrete but who knows) - I can help you on the structural side.
Right on, appreciate the detailed reply! Lol that's solid advice too. One of those that you mentioned has actually been my first choice!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bking60 View Post
We had a house plan designer do it on autocad. I drew in the beam locations and the lumber supplier had the LVL dealer look it over. He beefed it up for CYA. The bank wanted the whole package but agreed to skip electrical plans since I was doing the entire electrical. They were adamant on having house elevations.
This was in a different county.
Interesting idea, but could work here too. Thank you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by chassis View Post
whyzee125 what kind of structure are you thinking of? A garden shed or something grander?

Simple set of plans can be had on the internet. What is the reason for the architect?
I'm looking to build a small house (but not a tiny house) with a garage, efficient loft style interior, and a patio. I found exactly one design that exists that's perfect for my needs but the architect does not want to sell the plans and would rather design another one. I agreed but they wanted $25k to design a 700 square foot house which is absolutely insane. My parents paid $6k to have a house designed that's nearly 10 times that size. I would honestly pay $6k but not $25K, no way.
Appreciate 1
chassis3634.50
      09-22-2022, 09:38 PM   #10
2000cs
Captain
2724
Rep
987
Posts

Drives: Potato
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: USA

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by whyzee125 View Post
Right on, appreciate the detailed reply! Lol that's solid advice too. One of those that you mentioned has actually been my first choice!




Interesting idea, but could work here too. Thank you!



I'm looking to build a small house (but not a tiny house) with a garage, efficient loft style interior, and a patio. I found exactly one design that exists that's perfect for my needs but the architect does not want to sell the plans and would rather design another one. I agreed but they wanted $25k to design a 700 square foot house which is absolutely insane. My parents paid $6k to have a house designed that's nearly 10 times that size. I would honestly pay $6k but not $25K, no way.
Hunt down Pat Jeski in Michigan (suburbs of Ann Arbor and Detroit). Was a member of PCA back when he built his multi-car garage with lift, pit, bar and bathroom, with attached single guy really cool kitchen/bath/bedroom/sitting area and deck. In the woods, youíd never know it was there and never guess what the inside was like. May be a design to start from. This was 2009 so good luck.
Appreciate 0
      09-23-2022, 10:15 AM   #11
jsf721
Captain
United_States
812
Rep
660
Posts

Drives: 2019 540i X M Sport
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Long Island, NY

iTrader: (0)

My friend your journey has just begun. My advice is but some comfortable shoes.

Iím Doing a 3 floor addition. I interviewed a few architects and hired one. He flaked out. Hired a second on the recommendation of my contractor. Got the plans done and that tool 5 months. These guys are very busy at least the good ones near me.

So now we filed permits, I paid and expediter and a paid for fast track with the town. It was filed first week of June 2022 and Iím still waiting.
They are also swamped.

Only good news is cost of goods For construction seems to be decreasing instead of increasing.

Good luck. Whatever your time line double it. Whatever your budget for finishing after the build I added 30 percent to first estimate just to be safe. Thatís in my wifeís control so I pretty much dead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by whyzee125 View Post
I'm going to be building a house this year and I'm having a heck of a time finding a good architect.

You've probably seen me rant before that literally nobody can do anything right in my area and I'm once again finding this to be true. I can barely get anyone to answer the phone, let alone not lose my file, remember our appointments, and I've not yet gotten even one to get to the actual next step phase.

I don't want to have to beg someone repeatedly to call me back who is not eager to do the job that I'm paying them for. I'm ready to get someone out of state. Anyone on here do this for a living or know of one?
Appreciate 2
whyzee125935.50
nyalpine906978.50
      09-23-2022, 06:58 PM   #12
gtr2M3
New Member
61
Rep
17
Posts

Drives: M3
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: CA

iTrader: (0)

Man, if you feel this way now, you’re in for a very large disappointment throughout every step of the process, especially if you’re a hands on kind of person

Double your timeline, budget and patience
Appreciate 1
DETRoadster10624.50
      09-23-2022, 07:50 PM   #13
Tyga11
Major
2011
Rep
1,202
Posts

Drives: M4 Comp
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Arizona

iTrader: (0)

There's no money in residential architects. What kind of house are you looking to build? I can tell you if the house is not $4M+ you're in for a disappointment
Appreciate 0
      09-23-2022, 08:28 PM   #14
DETRoadster
Space Force - 4 Star General
DETRoadster's Avatar
10625
Rep
3,160
Posts

Drives: M2 MG 6MT / Moto Guzzi V7
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Seattle

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gtr2M3 View Post
Man, if you feel this way now, youíre in for a very large disappointment throughout every step of the process, especially if youíre a hands on kind of person

Double your timeline, budget and patience
This ^^^^

My wife and I bought property a couple years back and are about 18 months into working with an architect to design our house. I've been documenting the process here if you're interested: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1808634

I'd recommend against an out of state architect. You want someone who knows you're local codes and regulations.

Based on your budget for an architect I'm not surprised you're having problems finding one. Typically they charge 8% to 10% of the project budget for a fully custom home. It sounds like what you really need/want is someone to draw up some plans that you can then take to a structural engineer to get massaged, stamped, and then submit for permit. Can you find some boiler-plate plans online that you like and then have a local structural guy tweak them for your municipality? That should be a lot cheaper and easier than going through an architect. Your builder should be able to work with the structural engineer to help you make any tweaks you want to the plans.

if you have any questions about the process, fire away of feel free to DM me.
Appreciate 3
Tyga112011.00
chassis3634.50
vreihen169824.00
      09-23-2022, 09:16 PM   #15
Tyga11
Major
2011
Rep
1,202
Posts

Drives: M4 Comp
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Arizona

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by DETRoadster View Post
This ^^^^

My wife and I bought property a couple years back and are about 18 months into working with an architect to design our house. I've been documenting the process here if you're interested: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1808634

I'd recommend against an out of state architect. You want someone who knows you're local codes and regulations.

Based on your budget for an architect I'm not surprised you're having problems finding one. Typically they charge 8% to 10% of the project budget for a fully custom home. It sounds like what you really need/want is someone to draw up some plans that you can then take to a structural engineer to get massaged, stamped, and then submit for permit. Can you find some boiler-plate plans online that you like and then have a local structural guy tweak them for your municipality? That should be a lot cheaper and easier than going through an architect. Your builder should be able to work with the structural engineer to help you make any tweaks you want to the plans.

if you have any questions about the process, fire away of feel free to DM me.
I skimmed your thread. What a ride. My question is if you feel that it's been worth it for all that work vs buying a built house?
Appreciate 0
      09-23-2022, 09:31 PM   #16
DETRoadster
Space Force - 4 Star General
DETRoadster's Avatar
10625
Rep
3,160
Posts

Drives: M2 MG 6MT / Moto Guzzi V7
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Seattle

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyga11 View Post
I skimmed your thread. What a ride. My question is if you feel that it's been worth it for all that work vs buying a built house?
100,000% no. Not worth it. We should have found a shitty house on a nice lot and torn that down to all but the foundation and a single wall so it could still be considered a "remodel."

We totally underestimated the cost and complexity of building in our specific municipality. Now the OP here may well be in a part of the country that's like "Hey, it's your land, go for it." But in our case the red tape and other bullshit requirements are going to easily add $300,000 to the project before a single nail is driven into the house.
Appreciate 1
Tyga112011.00
      09-23-2022, 09:52 PM   #17
Tyga11
Major
2011
Rep
1,202
Posts

Drives: M4 Comp
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Arizona

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by DETRoadster View Post
100,000% no. Not worth it. We should have found a shitty house on a nice lot and torn that down to all but the foundation and a single wall so it could still be considered a "remodel."

We totally underestimated the cost and complexity of building in our specific municipality. Now the OP here may well be in a part of the country that's like "Hey, it's your land, go for it." But in our case the red tape and other bullshit requirements are going to easily add $300,000 to the project before a single nail is driven into the house.
What a nightmare. What part of Seattle are you located in out of curiosity?
Appreciate 0
      09-24-2022, 11:40 AM   #18
allinon72
Brigadier General
allinon72's Avatar
United_States
3971
Rep
3,371
Posts

Drives: 20' M2C, 22' X5 45e
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Indianapolis, IN

iTrader: (2)

Anyone who has anything to do with construction is slammed right now. Residential, commercial, industrial, you pick the industry. Add to the fact that they can barely keep up with their current workload due to a labor shortage. As a nation, we are building at a record pace and that pace is unsustainable given the current and predicted future economic environment. After an inevitable slowdown, it may be a little easier to nail someone down to a project, but who knows when that will be.

I hate to be a downer, but it's about the worst time ever to start a large scale, ground up residential dwelling.
Appreciate 1
vreihen169824.00
      09-24-2022, 08:08 PM   #19
BMWCCA1
BMW Owner Since 1971
1457
Rep
1,062
Posts

Drives: 1964 700 Sport Cabriolet
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Central Virginia

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
2013 BMW 128i  [0.00]
My degree (from 46-years ago) is a BS in Architecture. I've never practiced and would have had to spend two-more years in Grad School, or "sit" for an architect as an apprentice before I could have been licensed. Too much money and I already had too much student debt.

We bought land (6-acres) over 34-years ago when our oldest was 2yo, to build our dream house just down the street from our first house. It took us 32-years to be comfortable enough with the cost to actually get around to building our dream house. We had plenty of sketches that evolved over the years. We focused on design/build firms to give us estimates over ten-years ago and came up with figures that were easily three-times what we figured our cost-per-square-foot should have been. We finally sucked it up and figured we would have to spend at least twice what we wanted to get what we wanted. Several builders said our design had too many corners, and that a square plan would be cheaper. I asked them to give me the extra cost of each corner so I could decide which ones to vacate. Never got a straight answer. Several friends in the business of high-end design/build told me they charged so much that they would not recommend their firm to do our house. They had plenty of wealthy customers who were willing to pay whatever they asked.

So we paid one design build guy to take our plans and turn them into construction drawings so we could get a real quote. When he was done it was, again, three-times what we wanted to spend. So we asked for the plans, for which he charged us $2,000 for the time and consult, and then put me in touch with his structural guy to get the digital "drawings" from him. That designer told me what I'd paid for were not complete construction drawings and in fact they had no basement plan or structural drawings.

I took what I had to a retired contractor a county away who had built several nice homes in our area in the past and was recommended by one of my co-workers. Alan looked over the plans and said he could probably build the house himself with his son for about 2/3rds or less than our other bids, but he'd have to update his CAD program and completely re-do the plans, which he would include in his estimate. He sent me a viewer to view the structural plans in 3D and the quote from the fabrication shop which would supply the trusses from the CAD output.

We agreed to pay him directly monthly on work completed and also agreed that we would discuss any increases in any portion of the project prior to moving on, and also any savings would reduce the amount we would owe. I worked with the builder and his son at least one-day each week and the project was literally a 5-minute walk from where we lived at the time. He handled the well and septic and all inspections and permits. Our hydrologist was from the country and doubled as our well-driller, perc-tester, and water tester. When it came to cabinetry our contractor found a supplier of knocked-down kits of quality solid-woods from China that he said would save us around $20k over our construction bids in our quote from Lowe's for Virginia-made cabinetry. I found a hardwood floor contractor who came from 80-miles away but who could supply the 4-inch White Oak I wanted, and paid for that out of pocket. I found bathroom vanities from China direct from the California importer who promised he could beat Home Depot and Lowe's pricing on the same pieces and include shipping direct to our project. The quality was fantastic and they were air-freighted from LAX to Dulles and trucked 100-miles to our site at no charge. Even my contractor was impressed. Our windows came from a Virginia manufacturer and were gas-filled with all the latest U-factor and heat-gain ratings but at probably less than 1/4 the cost of what the local contractors quoted for windows.

The masons who did our foundation were family members from over in "The Valley" where craftsmanship and integrity seems to be more important than price. They were superb. My contractor said he had a hard time finding his other subs as many were either dead, drunk, or retired, so we waited on the framers—and waited—until my contractor started on the first floor saying he would not do the second floor. Then we waited until he said he'd frame the second floor—but not the roof! Then he hired some framer helpers and one of my good customers supplied his best crane operator to lift the trusses in place. An amazing skill to be able to place these so perfectly for the crew hanging-on 30-feet above the walk-out basement to hammer them in-place. Roofers were a Mexican family that came by in the evening after their other work, sometimes working in the dark with headlamps while their kids did their homework or played soccer down below. Mostly architectural shingles but hand-formed metal for the front porch and four dormers. Exterior is Hardy plank and board-and-batten painted on-site with three coats of Benjamin Moore colors chosen by my daughter. Concrete was supplied from two-counties away much cheaper than local, and the finishers were also from the Shenandoah Valley and were a pleasure to work with. I enjoyed working with all of them and always brought lunch for the crew on my day off which I spent working on-site. It was a great experience!

We started in November during one of the rainiest years on record and had to move a lot of earth and trees due to slope, drain-field, and to get the mountain view we knew was there 30-years before. The excavator was another friend of my contractor and he was the first to show up to dig the foundation. It took until February over a year later to get the occupancy certificate. This was a 3-bed, 2.5-bath house, two-stories with master suite on ground floor, large deck off the back and large front porch. We had a 2-1/2 car garage with two 24x24 bays and a right-angle motorcycle section today holding three bikes with plenty of work space for tool boxes and benches. The basement is a full basement with walk-out double man-door big enough to get my small cars and more bikes inside. Two heat-pumps with LP heat for the first floor, and a very efficient LP fireplace capable of keeping the whole house above 60ļ for a week-long power-failure during our second winter. We have unfinished spaces above the garage for a future apartment, and an unfinished "bonus" room upstairs above the master suite capable of being another small suite. Hardwood floors finished on-site everywhere but porcelain tile in the laundry and all three bathrooms. Six-foot-wide shower in the master bath with a 6-foot soaking tub. Five and a half foot bath upstairs. All together I think we hit 2,400 finished square-feet plus the full basement, two large unfinished spaces and a big garage. All quality LED lighting from an electrical contractor who was fantastic to work with, also. Some CAT6 runs, double breaker panels, etc. Sixty-something lighting fixtures. No ceiling fans because I hate them and don't need them even with 9-ft ceilings downstairs, 8 upstairs, and 15-foot cathedral ceiling in the open living room.

All building supplies came from a Shenandoah Valley supplier with the most beautiful quality 2x4s I've ever seen coming from Austria and our 2x6s coming from Sweden. Insulation is sprayed foam.

I think the total cost was around $460,000 in 2019. Our original estimates four-years prior had been around $750,000. Our original pipe-dream was to be around $250,000! We paid in cash since no one wanted to give us a construction loan even though we owned the lot valued at $350,000. We did take out a HELOC on our old house just to give us the flexibility in case we ran over our savings. There were no cost over-runs and we came in under budget, albeit with me paying out of pocket for the hardwood floor, fireplace, and vanities, though those were all under our original line-item-cost estimates.

Everyone tells me we built at just the right time, but it didn't feel that way at the time. Material costs were crazy, and kept going up, though we really didn't experience the supply-chain issues of today. Doing it again, I'd change a few minor things but we love the house and have enjoyed it for over three-years.




Last edited by BMWCCA1; 09-25-2022 at 08:42 AM..
Appreciate 1
vreihen169824.00
      09-24-2022, 09:40 PM   #20
aftercorbu
First Lieutenant
aftercorbu's Avatar
United_States
337
Rep
375
Posts

Drives: 20 M2C, 20 S3
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: South Carolina

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by allinon72 View Post
Anyone who has anything to do with construction is slammed right now. Residential, commercial, industrial, you pick the industry. Add to the fact that they can barely keep up with their current workload due to a labor shortage. As a nation, we are building at a record pace and that pace is unsustainable given the current and predicted future economic environment. After an inevitable slowdown, it may be a little easier to nail someone down to a project, but who knows when that will be.

I hate to be a downer, but it's about the worst time ever to start a large scale, ground up residential dwelling.
It is exceptionally busy and has been for a couple of years. My firm is in the US southeast, we have multiple offices and the depth, variety, and quality of our workload and pipeline are unprecedented across all of them. Of course things will slow down but could be some time, at least in growing areas of the country.

Material shortages are still a concern. Escalation may have slowed a bit, but only just recently. We broadly saw 1.5% cost increases month over month for large scale projects most of the year. Clients that tried to value engineer to save cost ended up having a larger price increase and still have to make qualitative and quantitative changes to start their project. There are some materials out there that are coming with no firm price or schedule and include an undefined mandatory change order. I’ve practices for nearly 30 years and have not experienced anything like this.

If you want to make a project happen you will need to plan ahead six months to a year to start design with any strong firm. We do some residential but mostly only for our current commercial clients.

To the OP be patient and look for the right partner and be prepared to wait if you want to move on this sooner than later. Sounds counterintuitive I know. And all the solid advice on here regarding cost and durations is based on reality right now, for residential anyway unfortunately.

I hope everything turns out great for your project, even though the journey is likely to be bumpy.
__________________
Appreciate 0
      09-26-2022, 10:34 AM   #21
nyalpine90
Lieutenant General
nyalpine90's Avatar
United_States
6979
Rep
11,496
Posts

Drives: MY21 G01 DG Msport
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: L.I. NY

iTrader: (4)

Garage List
2016 BMW X4  [10.00]
i work side by side with Architects.
you will need architect that does more residential then commercial.
you can go to the county office, see what architects have build homes recently.
Appreciate 1
whyzee125935.50
      09-26-2022, 01:26 PM   #22
Chihuahua
Colonel
Chihuahua's Avatar
3078
Rep
2,717
Posts

Drives: E30 329iS, E65 Alpina B7
Join Date: May 2012
Location: ATL

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gatorfast View Post
My friend Art Vandelay is an architect
I saw his new addition to the Guggenheim, apparently it didn't take that long.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:41 AM.




xbimmers
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST