[Andrew@DTUK]

Originally Posted by NISFAN

Nice, something very trusting about a company that advocates deception as the best policy

I think you'll find that's the advice that any tuning box company gives, no different from using a bluefin to remove a remap before heading back to a dealer

Failing that our product liability insurance kicks in and before you ask I'm more than prepared to scan a copy of our policy as I have nothing to hide.

what remappers telling customers that a dealer won't see a remap and that cracking open your ecu won't affect your warranty?


If your that concerned about tuning your car then leave it standard.

At least I'm sitting here being honest

[dopper99]

Originally Posted by stupot

Also a small thing to note, when I tried to return the box the attitude changed and it felt like I was dealing with a different
company.

I bought a tuning box from Andrew, going back - 4-5 years ago when I had a Vectra 3.0 CDTi. The box didnt work too well on the Vectra and Andrew refund me no problems whatsoever, seemed a friendly chap, but this was going back a few years now.

[Andrew@DTUK]

Originally Posted by dopper99

I bought a tuning box from Andrew, going back - 4-5 years ago when I had a Vectra 3.0 CDTi. The box didnt work too well on the Vectra and Andrew refund me no problems whatsoever, seemed a friendly chap, but this was going back a few years now.

Stuart received a refund minus a small fee, I can't remember the amount but it wasn't a lot

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by Andrew@DTUK

I think you'll find that's the advice that any tuning box company takes, no different from using a bluefin to remove a remap before heading back to a dealer

Failing that our product liability insurance kicks in and before you ask I'm more than prepared to scan a copy of our policy as I have nothing to hide.

what remappers telling customers that a dealer won't see a remap and that cracking open your ecu won't affect your warranty?


If your that concerned about tuning your car then leave it standard.

At least I'm sitting here being honest

As you mention Bluefin (superchips) you'll see that they issue their own warranty on mechanical failure (provided the car it is installed on still has OE warranty in place), so in theory if the engine or turbo fails, their own warranty kicks in to cover it. Do you do the same?

Extract from your own site:

No wires to cut, simply plug in and drive keeping your vehicles warranty intact.

Surely if 'sitting here and being honest ' you would include that your OE warranty would most likely be void on any drivetrain issues if found out to have been fitted with one of your tuning boxes.....No?

[RobUK]

I'm curious, I've heard suggestions in these forums that the F30 logs changes to the system such as those introduced by remaps, thus even if you remove a piggyback style remap device, the changes it made while attached will have been recorded and can be checked by the dealer and/or BMW, or that the car even proactively reports the change?

Is there any truth in this?

I had a previous BMW remapped (went for a custom tuning job rather than a bolt-on box as I figured it was worth the extra expense), and was very pleased indeed with the results; better performance and slightly improved economy. The car went into the dealer for routine servicing on a couple of occasions without any problems at all, but I'm wondering if 'smarter' cars mean the end of the road for these types of mods?

[JOHNBMWM5]

Originally Posted by RobUK

I'm curious, I've heard suggestions in these forums that the F30 logs changes to the system such as those introduced by remaps, thus even if you remove a piggyback style remap device, the changes it made while attached will have been recorded and can be checked by the dealer and/or BMW, or that the car even proactively reports the change?

Is there any truth in this?

I had a previous BMW remapped (went for a custom tuning job rather than a bolt-on box as I figured it was worth the extra expense), and was very pleased indeed with the results; better performance and slightly improved economy. The car went into the dealer for routine servicing on a couple of occasions without any problems at all, but I'm wondering if 'smarter' cars mean the end of the road for these types of mods?

I am checking this out with a BMW engineer I know.
I do not want BMW dumping my warrantee.

[Spacebug]

Originally Posted by Andrew@DTUK

Using my Iphone, so apologies for typing..

When you mentioned modes, did you mean the tuning box or the various driver modes on your car?

I meant the various driver modes on the car.

Eco-Pro
Comfort
Sport

Thanks

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by RobUK

I'm curious, I've heard suggestions in these forums that the F30 logs changes to the system such as those introduced by remaps, thus even if you remove a piggyback style remap device, the changes it made while attached will have been recorded and can be checked by the dealer and/or BMW, or that the car even proactively reports the change?

Is there any truth in this?

I had a previous BMW remapped (went for a custom tuning job rather than a bolt-on box as I figured it was worth the extra expense), and was very pleased indeed with the results; better performance and slightly improved economy. The car went into the dealer for routine servicing on a couple of occasions without any problems at all, but I'm wondering if 'smarter' cars mean the end of the road for these types of mods?

Rob,

If you had your car re-mapped, even if BMW noticed this during a service, they wouldn't say a thing about it. If your engine or turbo or something that they could even remotely pin to the re-map failed, they would just inform you that your warranty was void. They would 100% know the ECU was re-flashed, even if reversed again.

Many modern ECU's do have data logging facilities with history, I'd astounded if F30 didn't.

These piggy back devices aren't re-maps as is common belief. All they do is intercept the signal between sensor and ECU, fooling the ECU to control certain functions differently.

For example, the boost pressure sensor (MAP) might send back an anologue reading between 0-5Volts, 5Volts being maximum. Lets say your ECU is set to control the boost pressure at 1 bar, and this equates to 3 volts on your MAP sensor. Your ECU controls the wastegate/turbo vanes to achieve a 3 volt reading on the MAP input signal.
All these tuning box do is read the input signal (3V in this example) and outputs a lower value (lets say 2.5 volts) to the ECU. Result is the ECU turns up the boost until it happily reads 3V, which could be 3.5Volts reduced to 3V by the tuning box. This tricks the system to giving you a corresponding increase in boost pressure.

The tuning box is adjustable to what sort of gain to apply to the signal, so is a step up from just putting a resistor across the MAP signal. (Also many ECU's are self calibrating so soon learn the static resistor reading and self compensate) But not that clever as many don't even know basic info like RPM readings.

The same trick is applied to the fuel rail pressure sensor in order to fool the ECU into upping the pressure, and therefore amount of fuel injected. Pretty crude. Some ECU's won't know they are being fooled, others take more readings to cross reference, and may log these anomalies, or go into LIMP.

The above describes simple plug in devices (one's that just intercept the two sensors I mentioned), more elaborate tunable ones take control of the injectors and read more engine operating parameters, do a more complete job, but are much more costly.

A re-map is the most complete solution provided it is mapped by a pro.

[RobUK]

Thanks NISFAN, all makes sense. Think if I ever do decide to tweak this car it'll be along the lines of the M Performance exhaust, brake upgrade etc. P-Torque did a fantastic job last time, but the returns on petrol engines are smaller and I think keeping on the right side of the BMW warranty will play on my mind a lot more this time round

[TripleD]

Originally Posted by Spacebug

I meant the various driver modes on the car.

Eco-Pro
Comfort
Sport

Thanks

I'd like to know the answer to this one too

[f1swk]

only thing i will add is bmw have the biggest budget for development on their own engine

[jbtco]

I would be very concerned by the insurance implications. Do people declare these modifications ? I may be wrong but I suspect not in many cases. If it is discovered after a claim (like Nisfan says for warranty these things tend to come out only if substantial claim justifies in depth enquiry) not only could the insurance be invalid but I assume the insured open to action for attempted fraud.

I had a claim for a bump in my M3 a couple of years ago and got a subsequent substantial personal injury claim, I suspect dodgy but cleverly done so difficult to disprove. I was very glad to know that it was for the insurance company to contest and not me.

[SomeRandomer123]

Originally Posted by RobUK

I had my E81 re-mapped by P-Torque near Wolverhampton. Sure he'd be happy to answer any questions.

He came highly recommended by the guys over at babybmw.net. Did a brilliant job which involves analysing the car on the dyno before anything is done, discussing what you want, then applying your custom map. Following that he road tests the car, then lets you roadtest it for as long as you want, then only when you're happy with it you settle up. Cost me £400 (inc VAT) as I recall. The results were amazing, not only better all round performance but a slight improvement in mpg too. He also said that if by any chance the dealer wipes out the map he'd re-apply it f.o.c.

Was a 360 mile round trip to have the work done, but was worth every penny and I'd have no hesitation in going to him again.

PS - No connection with P-Torque, just a happy customer

Are you having anything done to your 328i?

[NISFAN]

For 328i owners

For 330D owners

Grrrrrr, what is wrong with the Youtube embed?

[JOHNBMWM5]

Originally Posted by NISFAN

For 328i owners


[u2b]gD98Wa2s7c8#![/u2b]


For 330D owners

[u2b]y1oBZ7cRMQc#![/u2b]


Grrrrrr, what is wrong with the Youtube embed?

Glad I am away on holiday tomorrow, not sure what to make of that

[RobUK]

Originally Posted by SomeRandomer123

Are you having anything done to your 328i?

Got to get the thing working properly first

Actually I'd be interested in the BMWP exhaust (not least cos I'd have shiny new exhaust tips) thing is I expect it'd be a lot of money for probably very little performance gain. Would probably sound nicer tho...

[SteveChester]

Originally Posted by johnbmw6

This will be going into my 330 D M Sport once run in.
http://www.diesel-performance.co.uk/...(2012-)_258-ps

Should go like stink.

Did you get one in the end and what are the results of it?

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by johnbmw6

Glad I am away on holiday tomorrow, not sure what to make of that

Fixed the links

[SomeRandomer123]

Originally Posted by RobUK

Got to get the thing working properly first

Actually I'd be interested in the BMWP exhaust (not least cos I'd have shiny new exhaust tips) thing is I expect it'd be a lot of money for probably very little performance gain. Would probably sound nicer tho...

Ha, thought you might say that!!

I'd like a shiny new pair of exhaust tips too - the 28i just destroys them for fun doesn't it...

BMW Perf exhaust would be great but not got that cash to spend on a lease car unfortunately. Especially as there's only 2 years left now! And as you say, no real performance gain.