[010101]

Originally Posted by ALPINE6SPD

Why not get a pre owned S? They drop likes BRICKS in resale. You can get a new one around here for 1500 over invoice.

The cheapest S within 250 miles of me is still $10k more than the base model with the discount I will get. I'd get an S if I could get one cheap, but I think I'll be happy with the base model. Real world acceleration numbers show it actually does better than Porsche claims. I've driven it pretty hard three times now. It's absolutely perfect at everything other than straight line acceleration, and it's pretty respectable at that too. Going around a corner in it is just too fun to care that I could have something else that would do 0-60 a couple tenths quicker.

[DrewKo]

Originally Posted by 010101

Actually what you're saying is total BS. First of all if you think the handling differences "won't be perceivable” then you obviously haven't driven both cars. A mid engine, stiff suspension, 2800LB car with performance tires is in an entirely different league than the 3600lb, run flat equipped, luxury suspension e92. I don't mean any disrespect to the Bimmer, but that is just a fact. I don't care if Shiv gives your 335i 700 RWHP it will not out handle (or out brake) a Cayman on a track. Anyone who had driven both cars would know that.

As far as real performance numbers go the Cayman S easily beats the 335i at every single one of them (slalom, braking, acceleration, top speed, road holding, lap times). This is according to an unbiased source (Road & Track) using two new cars in equal conditions. The 2.7 liter standard Cayman also easily beats the 335i in every single area of performance except straight line acceleration, and even there it is only a couple tenths behind to 60 and through the 1/4 (also according to Road & Track). The 335i is a great car, but it will never be the light weight, mid engine, perfectly balanced track day car the Cayman is. But then again it was never meant to be...


Edit: One other thing I forgot to mention. If you want to start talking about mods and what cars are cheaper for the performance you get think about what would happen if you bought an Evo RS and spent $1k on an ecu mod. You would have a car for well under $30k that would annihilate the 335i with or without Procede.

First off, I never said the BMW handles better--I said the Cayman S does. I said you would not notice the difference in daily driving conditions, which you won't, which is a fact. I have indeed test-driven a Cayman S and the BMW rides better, has better feel, and handles equally well. However, you obviously have never driven a Procede Sport tuned 335i with performance tires and Sport suspension. Edmunds found that the 335i actually has a tighter turning radius than the Cayman S (see below). This will only matter on a track, as I stated before.

As someone previously mentioned, you have on blinders focused on buying a lowly Cayman. So get one and get off this board. I can't understand why you come here without adequate knowledge simply to make yourself feel better about a decision you doubt or already know is incorrect--why? Because you are overpaying for the underperforming "Cockster," an apt name for your vehicle of choice. See Top Gear

. [Quoting Clarkston calling the Cayman, based on the Boster, the Cockster.] Clarkston says the Cockster is essentially a cheaper, underperforming 911. Sure there are positive attributes concerning the Cockster, which I readily admit, but it is a not a 911 and never will be.

Moreover, its not a 335i, which has more torque, more hp, more acceleration (which you admit), but costs ohhhh about $20k less than a Cayman S. And, it is a hell of a lot more fun to drive (because of the awesome acceleration and never ending torque that sets early in the rpm due to the piezo injectors blasting fuel into the twin turbos) and will make for a better daily driver. P.S., I have not only driven the Cockster, but I've raced 'em. I walked them everytime in a straight line, stock 335i. With the PROcede, it is not even close. A PROcede installed into the base 335i costs about $1,300, bringing the total to about $51k; your Cockster S--$70k (before taxes). With a decent set of wheels and tires on the stock 335i, a track race would be a driver's race with a Cayman S; against a Cayman, the BMW wins hands down. With the Procede, the 335i would crush either Cayman. You can't argue that the 335i is not the absolute best bang for the buck out there in terms of quality, appeal, fun, speed, handling, and drivability. It also seats four people comfortably and has trunk space for a set of golf clubs plus.

But those positive factors are unimportant to you. You only care about racing on the track or mountain roads. You must be out there every weekend. I am sure your "Cockster" will be well-respected on the track with all of the 997s, 996s, GT3s, 911 Turbos, and 911s. All of those will smoke your Cockster. Don't worry about it though. You will still be very well respected close to bottom of the barrell.

The real beauty of the 335i is that the sport version can hit the track and run it hard. But don't take my word for it; do some of your own research on this site. Then go waste extra $ and see if you are thrilled with the respect you garner with the Cockster. P.S., if you are ready to spend $70k on a Cockster S, you should get a new M3 and forget about the Cockster. What? You think the Cayman S will also out race an M3? Figures, Cockster. Get a 911.

BMW 335i stock:

zero to sixty 4.8; 114 ft. 60-0.
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=117669

Vishnu Tuned 335i Road Test.
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=119485

"Sixty mph arrives in 4.6 seconds and the quarter-mile flashes by in 13.0 seconds at 109 mph, 0.3 second quicker than the last stock 335i with an automatic transmission that we tested. And that's quicker than any stock Evo or Audi RS 4 we've ever tested."

http://www.edmunds.com/new/2007/bmw/...893/specs.html
Base Number of Cylinders: 6 Base Engine Size: 3 liters
Base Engine Type: Inline 6 Horsepower: 300 hp
Max Horsepower: 5800 rpm Torque: 300 ft-lbs.
Max Torque: 1400 rpm Drive Type: RWD
Turning Circle: 36.1 ft.


Cayman S
http://www.edmunds.com/apps/vdpconta...yman%20S#1

Over $70k

0-60 in 5.03 secs. 1/4 mile in 13.2

http://www.edmunds.com/new/2007/pors...766/specs.html
Acceleration (0-60 mph): 5.03 sec. Braking Distance (60-0 mph): 106.1 ft.
Base Number of Cylinders: 6 Base Engine Size: 3.4 liters
Base Engine Type: Horizontally Opposed Horsepower: 295 hp
Max Horsepower: 6250 rpm Torque: 250 ft-lbs.
Max Torque: 4400 rpm Drive Type: RWD
Turning Circle: 36.4 ft.

Only a Cockster would overpay $20k for underperformance. Wait a minute, you are not getting a Cayman S, merely a Cayman. So my comparisons only have to beat a mere 5.8 zero-to-sixty for the Cayman. Uh, there's no comparison and the price for the 335i is still less expensive; and the 335i beats the Cayman in the streets, the mountains or on a track. Maybe you should suck a Cockster instead of purchasing one?

[010101]

Originally Posted by DrewKo

First off, I never said the BMW handles better--I said the Cayman S does. I said you would not notice the difference in daily driving conditions, which you won't, which is a fact. I have indeed test-driven a Cayman S and the BMW rides better, has better feel, and handles equally well. However, you obviously have never driven a Procede Sport tuned 335i with performance tires and Sport suspension. Edmunds found that the 335i actually has a tighter turning radius than the Cayman S (see below). This will only matter on a track, as I stated before.

As someone previously mentioned, you have on blinders focused on buying a lowly Cayman. So get one and get off this board. I can't understand why you come here without adequate knowledge simply to make yourself feel better about a decision you doubt or already know is incorrect--why? Because you are overpaying for the underperforming "Cockster," an apt name for your vehicle of choice. See Top Gear

. [Quoting Clarkston calling the Cayman, based on the Boster, the Cockster.] Clarkston says the Cockster is essentially a cheaper, underperforming 911. Sure there are positive attributes concerning the Cockster, which I readily admit, but it is a not a 911 and never will be.

Moreover, its not a 335i, which has more torque, more hp, more acceleration (which you admit), but costs ohhhh about $20k less than a Cayman S. And, it is a hell of a lot more fun to drive (because of the awesome acceleration and never ending torque that sets early in the rpm due to the piezo injectors blasting fuel into the twin turbos) and will make for a better daily driver. P.S., I have not only driven the Cockster, but I've raced 'em. I walked them everytime in a straight line, stock 335i. With the PROcede, it is not even close. A PROcede installed into the base 335i costs about $1,300, bringing the total to about $51k; your Cockster S--$70k (before taxes). With a decent set of wheels and tires on the stock 335i, a track race would be a driver's race with a Cayman S; against a Cayman, the BMW wins hands down. With the Procede, the 335i would crush either Cayman. You can't argue that the 335i is not the absolute best bang for the buck out there in terms of quality, appeal, fun, speed, handling, and drivability. It also seats four people comfortably and has trunk space for a set of golf clubs plus.

But those positive factors are unimportant to you. You only care about racing on the track or mountain roads. You must be out there every weekend. I am sure your "Cockster" will be well-respected on the track with all of the 997s, 996s, GT3s, 911 Turbos, and 911s. All of those will smoke your Cockster. Don't worry about it though. You will still be very well respected close to bottom of the barrell.

The real beauty of the 335i is that the sport version can hit the track and run it hard. But don't take my word for it; do some of your own research on this site. Then go waste extra $ and see if you are thrilled with the respect you garner with the Cockster. P.S., if you are ready to spend $70k on a Cockster S, you should get a new M3 and forget about the Cockster. What? You think the Cayman S will also out race an M3? Figures, Cockster. Get a 911.

BMW 335i stock:

zero to sixty 4.8; 114 ft. 60-0.
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=117669

Vishnu Tuned 335i Road Test.
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=119485

"Sixty mph arrives in 4.6 seconds and the quarter-mile flashes by in 13.0 seconds at 109 mph, 0.3 second quicker than the last stock 335i with an automatic transmission that we tested. And that's quicker than any stock Evo or Audi RS 4 we've ever tested."

http://www.edmunds.com/new/2007/bmw/...893/specs.html
Base Number of Cylinders: 6 Base Engine Size: 3 liters
Base Engine Type: Inline 6 Horsepower: 300 hp
Max Horsepower: 5800 rpm Torque: 300 ft-lbs.
Max Torque: 1400 rpm Drive Type: RWD
Turning Circle: 36.1 ft.


Cayman S
http://www.edmunds.com/apps/vdpconta...yman%20S#1

Over $70k

0-60 in 5.03 secs. 1/4 mile in 13.2

http://www.edmunds.com/new/2007/pors...766/specs.html
Acceleration (0-60 mph): 5.03 sec. Braking Distance (60-0 mph): 106.1 ft.
Base Number of Cylinders: 6 Base Engine Size: 3.4 liters
Base Engine Type: Horizontally Opposed Horsepower: 295 hp
Max Horsepower: 6250 rpm Torque: 250 ft-lbs.
Max Torque: 4400 rpm Drive Type: RWD
Turning Circle: 36.4 ft.

Only a Cockster would overpay $20k for underperformance. Wait a minute, you are not getting a Cayman S, merely a Cayman. So my comparisons only have to beat a mere 5.8 zero-to-sixty for the Cayman. Uh, there's no comparison and the price for the 335i is still less expensive; and the 335i beats the Cayman in the streets, the mountains or on a track. Maybe you should suck a Cockster instead of purchasing one?

Your post is almost too stupid to warrant a response.. but okay.. I'll bite

If you read your own words you can see that you do not say that either car handles better. You say that the only advantage the Cayman *may* have is handling. You imply that the Cayman might have no advantages at all, and if it does it won’t be anything that would ever be noticeable. That statement is completely ridiculous to anyone who owns both cars or has driven both cars hard.

It's funny that you mention Clarkston who is notorious for disliking Porsches. Even he seemed to have a good time in this car. But the kicker is the very publication he works for went on to name the Cayman car of the year (hmmm not a BMW??)! That was a stupid thing for you to bring up, but it's the best you can come up with because this car has received universal praise from automotive journalists. A senior Motortrend staff member also said it would be the one car he would drive if he could have any car. It's the J.D. Power and Associates best in initial quality. A writer for a major Porsche magazine called the base Cayman the best Porsche at any price, and Porsche enthusiasts across the board agree that the Cayman platform is better than the 997's.

I guess my link in the original post is broken, but it shows Autocar testing all of the top performance cars on the road and picking the Cayman as the best. I will admit that they left the 335i out of their test since it is probably obvious to everyone but you that a heavy luxury car would not even be a contender. The 335i is an excellent car, but it's still a heavy luxury car. On a track with turns there is no comparison between the two. To even give a base Cayman any competition you would need to do a lot of aftermarket work to the 335 which would be money you would never recover when it came time to sell it.

I have nothing to defend here. I have not purchased either of these cars. I have however driven every single performance car on the road that costs less than $60k and the Cayman is one of my favorites. The Cayman is a platform that the 335i can never compete with on a track. You can give the Cayman more power, but you can never change the fact that the 335i is a huge, over weight front engine luxury car. Sure the Cayamn is more expensive, but you recover that money in resale. And you don't have to waste money replacing tires, suspension, upgrading brakes and doing all of the other stuff you'd have to do to a 335i to even get it close to being able to compete with the Cayman.

Even though your edmunds numbers are slightly different from my Road & Track numbers I notice how you conveniently leave out braking distances for the 335i. Would they disagree with your statement that the only advantage the Cayman might have is handling? All you can seem to point out after all of your digging is a completely insignificant 0.3 foot turning radius difference. You also don't seem too keen on talking slalom, lap time or skip pad numbers.

You quote the worst possible acceleration numbers for the Cayman (factory numbers) and you quote the best possible numbers for the 335i. At least be consistent like I was and use number from one source. R&T testing under the same conditions got a 0-60 time of 4.9 for the Cayman S, 5.0 for the 335i and 5.3 for the 2.7 liter Cayman. A Ford Lightening SVT will turn out good acceleration numbers, but who cares? If you want all out acceleration without worrying about handing, braking, or road holding neither the Cayman or the 335i are the right car for you.

I notice how you love to talk about the price difference in the Cayman for the performance you get, but you have absolutely no response to what I said about an Evo RS. Like I keep saying the 335i is great, but it's still a luxury car. It's not a "best bang for the buck" kind of car as you seem to think it is. It is far from ideal on the track. It is ideal for an every day driver. It is not a pure bread sports car by any means, and that’s okay. Just stop kidding yourself and telling yourself that your heavy GT car is some kind of contender with true pure bread sports cars around a race track...






PS The Cayman S is nowhere near "$70k before taxes" you are over $11k off and that's just talking MSRP. These cars routinely go for 11% off MSRP! And you tell me I don't have my facts straight.

[DrewKo]

I love your allegations to sources but no citation to them, and the misstatements of what you purport I say in the quoted material. You have a problem reading information and interpreting it correctly because of your blinders and stupidity. It just shows how you are avoiding what you already know by overpaying for an underperforming Cockster. You and that car have much in common--Cockster. Also, the weight difference in curb weight is only 474 lbs (the equivalent of your fat ass momma or sistah or wife). Source: Edmunds.com [http://www.edmunds.com/new/2007/bmw/...43/specs.html] 335i Curb Weight: 3340 lbs.; [http://www.edmunds.com/new/2007/pors...62/specs.html] Cockster Curb Weight: 2866 lbs.

If you are not getting the ceramic brakes (i.e., pushing the price tag up another 8-10k), there's no reason to compare stopping distances, which indeed are listed above (jackass) based on the overly priced ceramic brakes. The Edmunds review was based on a Cayman exceeding a $70k price tag. The standard Cayman is short-shrifted on brakes (but surely you already know that). P.S., Clarkston did not like the Cockster, which he could barely get in and out of. You must be about 5'0" so shouldn't be a problem for your small cranium.

"[T]he base Cayman scoots from 0 to 100 km/h (62 mph) in 6.1 seconds, about three- tenths of a second more than the 295-horsepower S." (Source: Road and Track http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=6&article_id=4015[/url]) (SLOW! That means about a 5.8-5.9 0-60 for your Cockster). "Cayman is fitted with smaller front brakes with monobloc 4-piston calipers."

Also, to beat a dead horse, how many posts are you ignoring where others state that the Cayman is unimpressive or slow?

RiXst3r
Lieutenant Major

Cayman...
245 hp (SAE) @ 6,500 rpm
Torque 201 lb.-ft.
0-60 mph in 5.8 s
Top Track Speed: 160 mph

"not impressed..."

catm3
flappy paddle gearbox

"I have drove both the Cayman and Cayman S. For me, there was a big difference. The acceleration was slow in the base Cayman. . . . It just too underpowered. It didn't feel much stronger than an EX V6 Honda Accord."

ksfrogman
Lieutenant General

"Cayman-S would be the way to go. Save up for that. You might regret having the non-S."

BIGWILL
I heard your eyeballs move Pvt!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"[I]f you're going to buy a Cayman, please buy the S, CPO'd or go with the 335 new with all the bells and whistles. "

fobunited
Member

""Before I ordered my 335, I also considered getting a Cayman. I drove it and loved how it drove, however I realized that it only FEELS fast, it isn't really fast."

The only person, including car magazine editors, who believes the standard Cayman is fast happens to be YOU! LOL. Then, you say it is only fast on a track! LOL! Get yourself a standard Cayman buddy and take it to the track to see how it sizes up. Then come back and post your 60ft and 1/4 and tell us how many cars lapped you (if you can count that high!). Standard Cockster, overpriced but eat your heart out.

[obLu]

I'm not saying the 335i isn't good. It's not like I don't own a 3 series myself, and would love to be able to justify to the wife why I need to trade my 330 in for a 335. But it just *isn't* a sports car. Which to me is the real argument.

I could take 10k and make a 76 Camaro faster in a straight line and handle better than the 335. (that 76 camaro actually weights about a 1000lbs less so it wouldn't be too tough to make handle better either) Doesn't make it a better sports car. But by the definition I'm getting from you it kind of would.

And come on, simmer down. It's just a discussion, where'd the 'jackass' stuff come from?

[canuck335i]

this thread is a big waste of bandwith... can't stand this stupid BMW vs Porsche, get the Porsche, be happy and go away if all it does is to stir shit all over the place, damn. Why did you need to justify your decision to us in the first place?

[DrewKo]

Originally Posted by obLu

Err .... no. Fanboy much?

(all stats from company websites)
Top Speed:
Porsche Cayman: 171mph
BMW 335i: 130/150mph depending on tires electronically limited (and don't give me crap about how it will do better if ... )

0-60:
Cayman: 5.1sec
335i: 5.3sec

I've already found you two areas where the 335 doesn't blow it away. It's got it on price ... and probably reliability. But that's like saying a Camry's got the 335 on price and reliability.

When are people going to get it that the 3 series, in none of it's iterations is a sports car? It's a GT. A Cayman is a sports car. A sports car isn't all about raw #'s .... even though the base Cayman's numbers are better than a 335's.

You are wrong, wrong, wrong--see the above links I posted.

[DrewKo]

Originally Posted by obLu

I'm not saying the 335i isn't good. It's not like I don't own a 3 series myself, and would love to be able to justify to the wife why I need to trade my 330 in for a 335. But it just *isn't* a sports car. Which to me is the real argument.

I could take 10k and make a 76 Camaro faster in a straight line and handle better than the 335. (that 76 camaro actually weights about a 1000lbs less so it wouldn't be too tough to make handle better either) Doesn't make it a better sports car. But by the definition I'm getting from you it kind of would.

And come on, simmer down. It's just a discussion, where'd the 'jackass' stuff come from?

More B.S. from you. Just stop posting this crap. Get a new wife too.:rocks:

[Viral]

Originally Posted by canuck335i

this thread is a big waste of bandwith... can't stand this stupid BMW vs Porsche, get the Porsche, be happy and go away if all it does is to stir shit all over the place, damn. Why did you need to justify your decision to us in the first place?

+1

[010101]

Originally Posted by DrewKo

I love your allegations to sources but no citation to them, and the misstatements of what you purport I say in the quoted material. You have a problem reading information and interpreting it correctly because of your blinders and stupidity. It just shows how you are avoiding what you already know by overpaying for an underperforming Cockster. You and that car have much in common--Cockster. Also, the weight difference in curb weight is only 474 lbs (the equivalent of your fat ass momma or sistah or wife). Source: Edmunds.com [http://www.edmunds.com/new/2007/bmw/...43/specs.html] 335i Curb Weight: 3340 lbs.; [http://www.edmunds.com/new/2007/pors...62/specs.html] Cockster Curb Weight: 2866 lbs.

If you are not getting the ceramic brakes (i.e., pushing the price tag up another 8-10k), there's no reason to compare stopping distances, which indeed are listed above (jackass) based on the overly priced ceramic brakes. The Edmunds review was based on a Cayman exceeding a $70k price tag. The standard Cayman is short-shrifted on brakes (but surely you already know that). P.S., Clarkston did not like the Cockster, which he could barely get in and out of. You must be about 5'0" so shouldn't be a problem for your small cranium.

"[T]he base Cayman scoots from 0 to 100 km/h (62 mph) in 6.1 seconds, about three- tenths of a second more than the 295-horsepower S." (Source: Road and Track http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=6&article_id=4015[/url]) (SLOW! That means about a 5.8-5.9 0-60 for your Cockster). "Cayman is fitted with smaller front brakes with monobloc 4-piston calipers."

Also, to beat a dead horse, how many posts are you ignoring where others state that the Cayman is unimpressive or slow?

RiXst3r
Lieutenant Major

Cayman...
245 hp (SAE) @ 6,500 rpm
Torque 201 lb.-ft.
0-60 mph in 5.8 s
Top Track Speed: 160 mph

"not impressed..."

catm3
flappy paddle gearbox

"I have drove both the Cayman and Cayman S. For me, there was a big difference. The acceleration was slow in the base Cayman. . . . It just too underpowered. It didn't feel much stronger than an EX V6 Honda Accord."

ksfrogman
Lieutenant General

"Cayman-S would be the way to go. Save up for that. You might regret having the non-S."

BIGWILL
I heard your eyeballs move Pvt!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"[I]f you're going to buy a Cayman, please buy the S, CPO'd or go with the 335 new with all the bells and whistles. "

fobunited
Member

""Before I ordered my 335, I also considered getting a Cayman. I drove it and loved how it drove, however I realized that it only FEELS fast, it isn't really fast."

The only person, including car magazine editors, who believes the standard Cayman is fast happens to be YOU! LOL. Then, you say it is only fast on a track! LOL! Get yourself a standard Cayman buddy and take it to the track to see how it sizes up. Then come back and post your 60ft and 1/4 and tell us how many cars lapped you (if you can count that high!). Standard Cockster, overpriced but eat your heart out.

Well I don't really feel the need to type any kind of lengthy response to your post this time. You were unable to address about 99% of my last post. I gave you a bunch of *facts* you are totally unable to counter, so you bring up things like the fact that rixster thinks the Cayman is slow as if that's relevant some how.

I give you real numbers and facts that you aren't articulate or smart enough to respond to. All you can do is quote other members here. I guess if you were capable of making an intelligent argument you would have been able to come up with something better than "go suck a coxster." That wouldn't even have been clever in high school.

Your comment about having to be 5' 0" to own a Cayman proves you have never even sat in one. People over 6'5" regularly get them because they don't fit well into other sports cars. I am 6'2" and I am more comfortable in the Cayman than the e92.

Once again you are quoting irrelevant bad numbers because you don't like the real ones. R&T's 6.1 number is a factory number for a triptronic Cayman which is a car we aren't even talking about here. I don't care if the triptronic one takes 20 minutes to get to 60 because I'm not buying it. Their real number for the base Cayman is 5.3. Look in the back of any recent issue.

Triptronic numbers aren't even relevant for Porsches because most Porsches are sold in stick. If you look on a Porsche lot even in LA there are mostly sticks. 335i's are mostly autos because they aren't track cars. A lot of women and daily commuters buy them. That's why they have single piston floating caliper brakes, and the Cayman has cross drilled, 4 piston caliper brakes at all four corners. This makes your quote about the base Cayman having slightly smaller 4 piston brakes than the S ridiculous. I guess you don't even realize your car has single piston floating calipers! That's only one step above drum brakes. Even the $26k Evo RS I keep mentioning comes with big multi-piston, cross drilled Brembos.

Anyway I could name advantages over the 335i all day, but that's not my purpose. I have respect for the 335i and think it is a good car for its intended purpose. You are the one who turned this into me having to attack your lies about the Cayman because you are insecure about your luxury car. I have already won since you are totally incapable of responding to almost every point I made in my last post. Now you'll probably try to respond to this one with more unintelligent irrelevant numbers and name calling. I'm sure you will once again ignore most of my facts since you don't have the ability to dispute them.

[DrewKo]

You are such a moron, it is frightening--I refuted all of your baseless allegations and proved the superiority of the 335i over a base Cayman. You have failed miserably to deny or refute that you are buying an overpriced Cockster, because you can't. Go buy it, schmuck.

P.S., the brakes on a 335i are world class and for you to suggest otherwise amply demonstrates your stupidity, lack of credibility, and bold-faced ignorance. Another false suggestion that is easily refuted.

From Clarkson speaking about the 335i,
"Lots of cars, for instance, are fitted with antilock brakes, but the system fitted to a BMW is just better. It only cuts in when you are in real trouble, and not — as is usually the case with modern cars — far too prematurely.

And then there are the brakes themselves. We’ve often wondered on Top Gear why BMWs always set such fast lap times round our track. You look at the power. You look at the weight. And you can’t really see how it got round so quickly. The Stig always has the same answer. “It’s the brakes,” he says. In Martian.

Because they’re so good, and because the ABS doesn’t stumble into the equation when it’s not wanted, you can hit the middle pedal later than you would in any other car. And when you are against the clock, that makes a huge difference."

Braking System: excellent--better than the M3. "The yin to the turbochargers’ yang are large 13.7-inch brakes up front and 13.2-inch rotors in back that are good for 160-foot stops from 70 mph — a foot better than the stopping distance of an M3. Brake feel is progressive, and the 335i comes with BMW’s brake-fade compensation that works to maintain constant pedal feel even when the brakes are overheating. After a few hot laps around GingerMan Raceway in western Michigan, the brake pedal remained responsive and off the floor." http://www.caranddriver.com/roadtest...35i-coupe.html

"The brakes are incredible, the body roll acceptable and bump absorption is beyond reproach." http://www.eurotuner.com/featuredveh...mw_335i_coupe/

"You feel it. The twin-turbocharged 3.0-liter's fat torque and upper rev-range power. The weighty steering that allows you to place the car wherever you want, whenever you want. The brakes that stop you now. And a sport suspension/chassis combination that absorbs the hardest driving you can throw at it while providing as much feedback as you'll ever need." http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dl...08001/0/STATIC

"No matter which model you choose, the 3 Series' world-class suspension, steering and brakes will provide hours of entertainment on twisty two-lane highways." http://www.edmunds.com/bmw/3series/2007/review.html

"The 335i adds matted 18-inch wheels (vs. 17s on the 328i and 328xi), larger brake discs front and rear, chrome exhaust tips, eight-way power front seats with memory on the driver's side and a 13-speaker Logic 7 audio system. Safety features that come standard on all 2007 3 Series coupes include frontal, side-impact and side-curtain airbags; dynamic stability control with several advanced braking technologies including one that helps remove water from the brakes in rainy weather . . . ." http://www.nctd.com/review-intro.cfm...&ReviewID=1942

"The 335i is the best driving BMW I've ever driven, and among the top three automobiles, I’ve experienced this millennium. It's a killer app that simply spanks the competition. In case I haven’t been clear, the BMW 335i Coupe is the best way to spend $40K - $50k on an automobile and feel like you got a bargain." http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=2204

"The 335i also has very large brakes: 13.7-inch discs on the front wheels and 13.2-inch discs at the rear. BMW is known for its marvelous brakes. . . ." http://www.automotive.com/2007/43/bm...ons/index.html

"The brakes are sure and strong" http://www.thecarconnection.com/Vehi...0972.html?pg=2

BUT..................................
"The Cayman S Brakes have a diameter measuring 12.52 inches in front and 11.77 inches at the rear" SMALLER BRAKES COCKSTER! http://www.porsche.com/usa/models/ca...s/?gtabindex=4

[010101]

Once again you ingore 99% of my facts and just post a bunch of meaningless quotes. And even with the one fact out of about 50 you try to dispute you are wrong.

Sure, for single piston floating caliper luxury car brakes they aren't bad, but they aren't in the same class at the Cayman's. They will fade on a race track very very quickly. Why do you think BMW gave them electronic fade resisting technology. Basically when they start fading the computer brakes harder for you. Aside from the fading issues here are the stopping distance numbers (again from the back of a road and track):

Cayman 60-0: 110'

335i 60-0: 119'

Cayman 80-0: 194'

335i 80-0: 210'


Now are you ready to talk slalom speed?

[DrewKo]

MW 335i stock: 114 ft. 60-0.
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=117669

Get your facts right. Again you post links to no sources, just your imagination. You are now the first person to claim the BMW has poor brakes. Moron. Get your cockster and leave!!

[010101]

Originally Posted by DrewKo

MW 335i stock: 114 ft. 60-0.
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=117669

Get your facts right. Again you post links to no sources, just your imagination. You are now the first person to claim the BMW has poor brakes. Moron. Get your cockster and leave!!

First of all I have cited every single thing I've said to you. I can't give you a link because I'm reading it out of Road & Track. Go look at the performance test index in the back of any recent issue. Second even with the very best unequal test conditions test you found the Cayman still beats it! Third I never said the BMW has poor brakes I said the Caymans are better for the track which is true.

And lastly... listen to this recording I found of you:

http://www.musicwebtown.com/jen12312...208/308039.mp3




You wanted links so bad so I gave you one....

[FirstClass]

In response to the brake discussion, you have to remember that Porsche offers sick as hell carbon-ceramic brakes on the Cayman, no such option exists for the 335i.

DrewKo: You clearly suffer from very advanced fanboism. It may be too late to save you but I'll try.

You can say a 335i will slap the shit out of a Cayman S if you do some mods to it and the 335i will still be cheaper. This may be true, but I can say the same thing about an Evo. I can put a few thousand into a stock Evo and have a 12 second car in my garage that any moron with two feet can launch. (AWD 4tw) You don't even need to get a new Evo, you could get a 7 or 8 used and probably buy+mod 2 or 3 for the price of a 335i. And the Evo will kick the ever living crap out of both the Cayman and the 335i for a fraction of the price. There was a review done comparing the Cayman S to the Evo IX MR by a few mags and the Evo was dead even or just slightly ahead in every one. (Plus that Evo was bone stock) Now imagine it modded.

Stock for stock a Cayman is a much better car than a 335i. A Cayman is an actual sports car whereas the 335i is a sporty car. Cayman handling feel just can't be matched by a 335i. It's like comparing a Z06 to an F430. Sure the Z06 is as fast/faster, but are you really going to argue that it's a better car? I think not.

Cliff notes: There is always something faster out there for cheaper. A 335i is not God's gift to automobiles. You didn't buy a sports car, deal with it and STFU.

[010101]

Originally Posted by FirstClass

In response to the brake discussion, you have to remember that Porsche offers sick as hell carbon-ceramic brakes on the Cayman, no such option exists for the 335i.

DrewKo: You clearly suffer from very advanced fanboism. It may be too late to save you but I'll try.

You can say a 335i will slap the shit out of a Cayman S if you do some mods to it and the 335i will still be cheaper. This may be true, but I can say the same thing about an Evo. I can put a few thousand into a stock Evo and have a 12 second car in my garage that any moron with two feet can launch. (AWD 4tw) You don't even need to get a new Evo, you could get a 7 or 8 used and probably buy+mod 2 or 3 for the price of a 335i. And the Evo will kick the ever living crap out of both the Cayman and the 335i for a fraction of the price. There was a review done comparing the Cayman S to the Evo IX MR by a few mags and the Evo was dead even or just slightly ahead in every one. (Plus that Evo was bone stock) Now imagine it modded.

Stock for stock a Cayman is a much better car than a 335i. A Cayman is an actual sports car whereas the 335i is a sporty car. Cayman handling feel just can't be matched by a 335i. It's like comparing a Z06 to an F430. Sure the Z06 is as fast/faster, but are you really going to argue that it's a better car? I think not.

Cliff notes: There is always something faster out there for cheaper. A 335i is not God's gift to automobiles. You didn't buy a sports car, deal with it and STFU.

*VERY* well said FirstClass. Thank you for posting that. I've been waiting for someone intelligent to respond to this thread all day.

[DrewKo]

Two morons. One who does not own a 335i Sport (probably wishes he did) and the other who owns neither a Porsche nor a BMW. We're not talking about Evos genius. We are not talking about ceramic brakes. The discussion concerned a stock base Cayman (not an S with ceramic $10,000 brakes) vs. a 335i, which will walk a base Cayman all day long in any race whatever. Get the base Cayman...more power to ya. 'Nuff said. STFU both you morons.

[010101]

Originally Posted by DrewKo

Two morons. One who does not own a 335i Sport (probably wishes he did) and the other who owns neither a Porsche nor a BMW. We're not talking about Evos genius. We are not talking about ceramic brakes. The discussion concerned a stock base Cayman (not an S with ceramic $10,000 brakes) vs. a 335i, which will walk a base Cayman all day long in any race whatever. Get the base Cayman...more power to ya. 'Nuff said. STFU both you morons.

LOL I love it. Now that you have been unable to make a single valid point you have resorted to name calling again. You know what else is funny? After watching your vids I realized that even if your car wasn't heavy and didn't have floating calipers it would still be turning the brakes blue and smoking after a couple laps because it's a slush box with little compression braking. You hate talking about Evos because you want to think the 335i (which isn’t even considered to be a true sports car by BMW) is the best performance bang for the buck on the road which it simply isn’t. It wasn’t designed to be. It’s a luxury GT. Get over it.

[ironic]

i was debating btwn the cayman and the 335i, i love my 335i to death, but i think i coulda lived with the cayman too. i went w/ the 335i for 2 extra seats, but find i don't use the two in the back and wouldn't want to anyways

[010101]

Originally Posted by ironic

i was debating btwn the cayman and the 335i, i love my 335i to death, but i think i coulda lived with the cayman too. i went w/ the 335i for 2 extra seats, but find i don't use the two in the back and wouldn't want to anyways

Yeah if you need the seats the 335i is a no brainer. I feel kinda bad this turned into a 335i vs Cayman bashing thread although it wasn't all my fault. The 335i is an awesome car. Both of them obviously have their advantages. I was thinking the same thing that you were about the seats. Then I realized how much space the Cayman had (more than any other 2 seater I can think of) and figured it would work. Plus if I end up with the Cayman and my gf asks me if I can give her friends a ride I can tell her "no, I wish we could... but yuh know... no room" Hopefully she doesn't read this.

[uhaulball]

Originally Posted by 010101

Yeah if you need the seats the 335i is a no brainer. I feel kinda bad this turned into a 335i vs Cayman bashing thread although it wasn't all my fault. The 335i is an awesome car. Both of them obviously have their advantages. I was thinking the same thing that you were about the seats. Then I realized how much space the Cayman had (more than any other 2 seater I can think of) and figured it would work. Plus if I end up with the Cayman and my gf asks me if I can give her friends a ride I can tell her "no, I wish we could... but yuh know... no room" Hopefully she doesn't read this.

dont worry about it. i learned that any mention of any car in e90post eventually turns into a ___ vs e92 thread.

even when i post something about an e90, the influx of new e92 members will say something like "i still like my e92 better." go figure!

[010101]

Originally Posted by uhaulball

dont worry about it. i learned that any mention of any car in e90post eventually turns into a ___ vs e92 thread.

even when i post something about an e90, the influx of new e92 members will say something like "i still like my e92 better." go figure!

I think the bottom line is that no matter how good a car is there is always something out there that is better in some ways. The e9x is way better than the Cayman at some things and vice versa. Some people just can't accept that their car isn't the absolute best car in every single area. Oh well, I guess the best and worst thing about the net is that everyone in the world can have their say.