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      11-15-2016, 03:22 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z K View Post
The FDA is definitely needed. Who else will make sure the food we eat won't kill us? And legal drugs coming into the country meet American standards?

As someone who has worked in both the food and drug (pharmaceutical) industry, the FDA is way underfunded for the work they do.

If you want faster processes, you need more people or more efficient systems. But some things can't be avoided, food/drug shipments have to be inspected. Restaurants, food preparation facilities have to be inspected by people and make sure they're safe. New drugs are evaluated for safety and effectiveness before they get approval to be sold. It's a major safety issue to not have these systems in place.

When there's a E. Coli outbreak, the FDA shuts down the restaurant and traces the food back to the origin. Without record keeping, data systems and people doing inspections, none of these controls would exist.
It is needed, just need to be overhauled and not be controlled by the same guy who was a top executive in Monsanto. it was a Lobbying move or however you would put it. Billionaire company pushing GMO agenda and pesticides places their top exec in charge of the dept in the government that would approve their existence and say their products are safe.
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      11-15-2016, 03:28 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z K View Post
The FDA is definitely needed. Who else will make sure the food we eat won't kill us? And legal drugs coming into the country meet American standards?

As someone who has worked in both the food and drug (pharmaceutical) industry, the FDA is way underfunded for the work they do.

If you want faster processes, you need more people or more efficient systems. But some things can't be avoided, food/drug shipments have to be inspected. Restaurants, food preparation facilities have to be inspected by people and make sure they're safe. New drugs are evaluated for safety and effectiveness before they get approval to be sold. It's a major safety issue to not have these systems in place.

When there's a E. Coli outbreak, the FDA shuts down the restaurant and traces the food back to the origin. Without record keeping, data systems and people doing inspections, none of these controls would exist.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GabeS View Post
It is needed, just need to be overhauled and not be controlled by the same guy who was a top executive in Monsanto. it was a Lobbying move or however you would put it. Billionaire company pushing GMO agenda and pesticides places their top exec in charge of the dept in the government that would approve their existence and say their products are safe.
I agree with both of you. Emulating Canada's FDA would be a good starting point.
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      11-15-2016, 04:04 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by GabeS View Post
Dept of Energy definitely needs to go or be overhauled and the FDA definitely needs to be overhauled, every department that is there with the sole purpose of enriching the government and keeping people slaves needs to be overhauled.
Medication can't enter the country so we can over inflate American made prices.

Clean or free energy inventions are stomped and shut down by the DOE.

People cant collect rainwater or go grid free or the government will throw them in prison...
Not sure if serious. You can collect rainwater and/or grid-free without any governmental reprisals. The utilities are only required to provide you with service if you ask for it. If you don't ask for it (nor need it), then you are free to disconnect.
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      11-15-2016, 06:14 PM   #70
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Found this article about the Dept of Education:

http://www.freedomworks.org/content/...right-thing-do

Basically, the DoE was started in 1979 by Jimmy Carter, as a payoff to the Teachers Union that got him elected. The budget is currently $40B, and test scores of high school seniors on national tests are flat or below where they were in 1979, before the department was created.

There are many other online sources saying the same thing.
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      11-15-2016, 06:21 PM   #71
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And the Department of Commerce looks like just about a complete waste:

http://thehill.com/blogs/congress-bl...rce-department

Even Obama wanted to cut it back - until he tried to justify Obamacare under the Commerce Clause...

http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-dru...rce-department
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      11-15-2016, 06:22 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Tonka View Post
I agree with both of you. Emulating Canada's FDA would be a good starting point.
Agree, FDA = good but need some oversight. Can't be biased.

I'm not anti Monsanto. They're often vilified for their procedures in producing seeds that can't be re-used. As a corporation, they want to make money and that's their way to get people to pay more. They've also created very good varieties of vegetables and improved efficiency of food production. So there's good and bad to it. They need to be evaluated without bias either way.
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      11-15-2016, 06:44 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post
Found this article about the Dept of Education:

http://www.freedomworks.org/content/...right-thing-do

Basically, the DoE was started in 1979 by Jimmy Carter, as a payoff to the Teachers Union that got him elected. The budget is currently $40B, and test scores of high school seniors on national tests are flat or below where they were in 1979, before the department was created.

There are many other online sources saying the same thing.
As I said earlier, this will be a crazy move and make the rich get great education and those who can't afford it will get worse. At least now, disadvantaged people can still get federal funding for education regardless of income.

Funding for education has been cut so many times, most wealthy people pay for private schools for their children to get good education. To erode public education is class warfare on the middle class and poor who can't afford private education.
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      11-15-2016, 07:17 PM   #74
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Toss IRS and epA to that dumpster fire
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      11-15-2016, 08:50 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z K View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post
Found this article about the Dept of Education:

http://www.freedomworks.org/content/...right-thing-do

Basically, the DoE was started in 1979 by Jimmy Carter, as a payoff to the Teachers Union that got him elected. The budget is currently $40B, and test scores of high school seniors on national tests are flat or below where they were in 1979, before the department was created.

There are many other online sources saying the same thing.
As I said earlier, this will be a crazy move and make the rich get great education and those who can't afford it will get worse. At least now, disadvantaged people can still get federal funding for education regardless of income.

Funding for education has been cut so many times, most wealthy people pay for private schools for their children to get good education. To erode public education is class warfare on the middle class and poor who can't afford private education.
I don't disagree with you at all about the value of public education. The rich, however, have been privately educating forever. Not sure why we can't have a voucher system for everyone else?

But at the end of the day, the Dept of Education has done nothing to improve the problem, but likely made it worse. It needs to go or be significantly reformed by someone other than the Teachers Union.
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      11-15-2016, 08:51 PM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z K View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Tonka View Post
I agree with both of you. Emulating Canada's FDA would be a good starting point.
Agree, FDA = good but need some oversight. Can't be biased.

I'm not anti Monsanto. They're often vilified for their procedures in producing seeds that can't be re-used. As a corporation, they want to make money and that's their way to get people to pay more. They've also created very good varieties of vegetables and improved efficiency of food production. So there's good and bad to it. They need to be evaluated without bias either way.
Monsanto for a bad rap from that McDonalds movie. It was largely undeserved- the Monsanto lawsuits were all valid, if you read the backgrounds. They were actually pretty nice to the offenders.
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      11-16-2016, 01:06 AM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaghave View Post
Toss IRS and epA to that dumpster fire
Stupid idea is down right retarded.
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      11-16-2016, 01:08 AM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post
Found this article about the Dept of Education:

http://www.freedomworks.org/content/...right-thing-do

Basically, the DoE was started in 1979 by Jimmy Carter, as a payoff to the Teachers Union that got him elected. The budget is currently $40B, and test scores of high school seniors on national tests are flat or below where they were in 1979, before the department was created.

There are many other online sources saying the same thing.
Found that article on a right leaning thinktank - who would have thought. Problem I have is stating what the budget is, and not actually stating how it's allocated. It certainly isn't paying for education directly.
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      11-16-2016, 01:09 AM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post
I don't disagree with you at all about the value of public education. The rich, however, have been privately educating forever. Not sure why we can't have a voucher system for everyone else?

But at the end of the day, the Dept of Education has done nothing to improve the problem, but likely made it worse. It needs to go or be significantly reformed by someone other than the Teachers Union.
Made it worse HOW?
Voucher systems are terrible, public money shouldn't be used to enrich private enterprise like education, that money should be going towards improvements to the public school system.
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      11-16-2016, 07:29 AM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
Stupid idea is down right retarded.
IRS will be abolish the moment we revoke the income tax, we shouldn't be tax for just working

EpA causes more damage then it prevent they had the whole Colorado and pa disaster in this last year and the shutting down of half of the clean burning coal plants have resulted in dirty coal plant being built in Mexico instead.
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      11-16-2016, 07:45 AM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post
Found this article about the Dept of Education:

http://www.freedomworks.org/content/...right-thing-do

Basically, the DoE was started in 1979 by Jimmy Carter, as a payoff to the Teachers Union that got him elected. The budget is currently $40B, and test scores of high school seniors on national tests are flat or below where they were in 1979, before the department was created.

There are many other online sources saying the same thing.
Found that article on a right leaning thinktank - who would have thought. Problem I have is stating what the budget is, and not actually stating how it's allocated. It certainly isn't paying for education directly.
Right-leaning think tank or not - it's hard to argue that no difference has been made in 40 years. Whatever we are spending is apparently too much? This looks like LBJ's "war on poverty" - after 50 years and trillions of taxpayer dollars, it made zero difference. Fail.
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      11-16-2016, 07:52 AM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post
I don't disagree with you at all about the value of public education. The rich, however, have been privately educating forever. Not sure why we can't have a voucher system for everyone else?

But at the end of the day, the Dept of Education has done nothing to improve the problem, but likely made it worse. It needs to go or be significantly reformed by someone other than the Teachers Union.
Made it worse HOW?
Voucher systems are terrible, public money shouldn't be used to enrich private enterprise like education, that money should be going towards improvements to the public school system.
Made it worse by diverting resources that could have made it more effective.

Vouchers wouldn't cover the cost of private schools. Regardless, think of it as a public-private partnership. Most people would still send their kids to public schools, and all would benefit with some competition. Just like healthcare benefits from some competition.
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      11-16-2016, 08:26 AM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaghave View Post
IRS will be abolish the moment we revoke the income tax, we shouldn't be tax for just working

EpA causes more damage then it prevent they had the whole Colorado and pa disaster in this last year and the shutting down of half of the clean burning coal plants have resulted in dirty coal plant being built in Mexico instead.
What stupid ideas, you should be ashamed for simply believing they are remotely credible.

You SHOULD BE TAXED FOR WORKING IN THE US. There is a price to pay to be apart of society, and to keep it working. Typical conservative freeloader.

Next you say we should abolish the EPA because clean air and water are obviously less important than some company making million-billions more dollars. What a fucking ridiculous assertion, just as silly as stating "clean coal" as if it's real.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post
Right-leaning think tank or not - it's hard to argue that no difference has been made in 40 years. Whatever we are spending is apparently too much? This looks like LBJ's "war on poverty" - after 50 years and trillions of taxpayer dollars, it made zero difference. Fail.
So you agree we need to reform the system and provide more federal control and oversight? Glad we are on the same page, finally.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbbbmw View Post
Made it worse by diverting resources that could have made it more effective.

Vouchers wouldn't cover the cost of private schools. Regardless, think of it as a public-private partnership. Most people would still send their kids to public schools, and all would benefit with some competition. Just like healthcare benefits from some competition.
"diverting resources that could have made it less effective"

Next sentence

"let's divert public school funds to private entities" where you just acknowledged that it's counter productive. Wow.

Beyond that, there is no basis on the idea that a public private partnership would make schooling better. Being private in itself is not a guarantee it's going to be run better, or provide a better education, and it's STUPID for someone to assume so.

What is funny, is some dunderhead in Washington actually sold that as a legitimate idea - and it exist as Charter Schools.

Charter Schools on average pay teachers less than Public Schools and actually perform WORSE, even though they have selection bias on their side.

http://www.centerforpubliceducation....ts-At-a-glance

Last edited by Taskmaster; 11-16-2016 at 08:32 AM..
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      11-16-2016, 11:06 AM   #84
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Originally Posted by schoy View Post
Not sure if serious. You can collect rainwater and/or grid-free without any governmental reprisals. The utilities are only required to provide you with service if you ask for it. If you don't ask for it (nor need it), then you are free to disconnect.
just do a quick search " is it legal to collect rainwater in the USA"
http://www.naturalnews.com/029286_ra...ion_water.html
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      11-16-2016, 11:31 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAxiom View Post
What stupid ideas, you should be ashamed for simply believing they are remotely credible.

You SHOULD BE TAXED FOR WORKING IN THE US. There is a price to pay to be apart of society, and to keep it working. Typical conservative freeloader.

Next you say we should abolish the EPA because clean air and water are obviously less important than some company making million-billions more dollars. What a fucking ridiculous assertion, just as silly as stating "clean coal" as if it's real.



So you agree we need to reform the system and provide more federal control and oversight? Glad we are on the same page, finally.


"diverting resources that could have made it less effective"

Next sentence

"let's divert public school funds to private entities" where you just acknowledged that it's counter productive. Wow.

Beyond that, there is no basis on the idea that a public private partnership would make schooling better. Being private in itself is not a guarantee it's going to be run better, or provide a better education, and it's STUPID for someone to assume so.

What is funny, is some dunderhead in Washington actually sold that as a legitimate idea - and it exist as Charter Schools.

Charter Schools on average pay teachers less than Public Schools and actually perform WORSE, even though they have selection bias on their side.

http://www.centerforpubliceducation....ts-At-a-glance

I feel this was a troll post
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      11-16-2016, 11:36 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaghave View Post
I feel this was a troll post
Every political thread has some guy that takes the bully stance, anything that he doesn't agree with is just stupid/idiotic/blah blah, hard head and close minded, never even thinks about the possibility of what the others are bringing to light.
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      11-16-2016, 11:42 AM   #87
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Quote:
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I feel this was a troll post
Lol, no more troll post compared to whatever you have posted.
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      11-16-2016, 11:43 AM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GabeS View Post
Every political thread has some guy that takes the bully stance, anything that he doesn't agree with is just stupid/idiotic/blah blah, hard head and close minded, never even thinks about the possibility of what the others are bringing to light.
What others are 'bringing to light' are factually substantiated in any way, unlike my position. It's hilarious how dismissive people are in light of how incorrect and stupid their opinions are.
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