[Hops128i]

You know, the idea of no f30 wagon is really upsetting me. After getting my 128i, i was hoping to move up to a 3 series wagon in the future. Just today, I saw a nice 328i wagon and it reaffirmed my desire. An x3 look totally clunky in comparison. Anyway, i guess the wagon market keeps getting smaller with volvo also leaving the US. Maybe audi will fill in the hole?

[Nikos335i]

Originally Posted by Touring

No wonder the wagons are selling bad in the States when they are not importing them

Originally Posted by quality_sound

True, but the Tip in the Avant is very, very good. It surprised me so much that I ordered one. Now they're telling me it's a 14 week wait. Fuck that. So now I'm looking at the 328iT, 335d, and Countryman. Ugh... I hate this part. If i knew BMW was going to make an F30 Touring with a manual I'd buy a beater and wait.

It's a shame that the wagons just don't do well in North America. It was a shame already having limited choices (3 and 5 Touring with one engine choice), Volvo getting out of the NA segment, Audi not offering the S4 Avant or a manual option in the A4.

I believe people see wagons here like the old boxes on wheels (aka: insert Griswald's puke green monster with wood paneling and all).

I myself will be replacing my 335i with an 2011 A4 Avant Sline Black/Black, yes it's an auto (but so was the E90, tx to the wife!) but regardless. I'm downgrading in perforance I know but hey the rest seems pretty good! We were limited before and it's getting worse it seems!

When the time comes to replace the E61 chances are the A6 will be the only alternative (E class perhaps but not likely), or perhaps the X3/Q5.

I will not do the 5 GT as I really do not like the styling at all maybe the 3 series GT will be nicer haven't seen any photos but I doubt it.

[MazdaFan]

3 GT will be a 4 dr hatchback, much better looking than the 5 GT, so it can be an alternative for the 3 series touring.

With 1 series BMW doesn't need the 3 compact anymore, so the GT is positioned above the 3 sedan, unlike the compact which always positioned lower than the 3 sedan.

There is also a chance that BMW will keep one touring in the lineup. I doubt that they want to give the market entirely to A4 avant and tsx.

[darkcloud]

Originally Posted by Nikos335i

It's a shame that the wagons just don't do well in North America. It was a shame already having limited choices (3 and 5 Touring with one engine choice), Volvo getting out of the NA segment, Audi not offering the S4 Avant or a manual option in the A4.

I believe people see wagons here like the old boxes on wheels (aka: insert Griswald's puke green monster with wood paneling and all).

I myself will be replacing my 335i with an 2011 A4 Avant Sline Black/Black, yes it's an auto (but so was the E90, tx to the wife!) but regardless. I'm downgrading in perforance I know but hey the rest seems pretty good! We were limited before and it's getting worse it seems!

When the time comes to replace the E61 chances are the A6 will be the only alternative (E class perhaps but not likely), or perhaps the X3/Q5.

I will not do the 5 GT as I really do not like the styling at all maybe the 3 series GT will be nicer haven't seen any photos but I doubt it.

True about the old school thinking of wagons.

as for the A4 avant. Check out the APR chip, it will get the A4 into the 270 hp and tq range. Not bad for $500. The 2.0T is severly under/detuned however you want to look at it. Add in an exhaust, up/down pipes and you'll hit 300 pretty easily. So it won't be too much of a downgrade.

[Tom K.]

Originally Posted by Hops128i

You know, the idea of no f30 wagon is really upsetting me. After getting my 128i, i was hoping to move up to a 3 series wagon in the future. Just today, I saw a nice 328i wagon and it reaffirmed my desire.

If it was near Rockville, it might have been mine. As my 128i 'vert is for fun and touring, I finally found a CPO manual transmission '07 E91 to replace my aging E46 daily driver last year and snapped it up. So if BMW makes the mistake of not importing the F30 version, you might check out the used wagons on BMWUSA.com when you're ready to buy.

Tom

[quality_sound]

Originally Posted by Leprechaun

Is this a joke? Who in the world would want a wagon? If you want a wagon, just go all out and get a SUV and become a soccer mom. Why bother getting a BMW. Only in America.

You have that so backwards it's not even funny. Typical American attitude that "our way is the only way". Only in America would someone buy an SUV when they need a wagon. Why the hell would someone buy an SUV, which would drive like a truck and get the mileage of a truck when a wagon will do EVERYTHING an SUV will drive better and get better mileage? There is almost NO reasons for ANYONE to buy an SUV since everything it does can be done, and done better, than something else.

Ford and Chevy did the best marketing job in history when they convinced Americans to forgo wagons in favor of big-ass SUVs. They were selling the Kool-Aid and you drank all of it and then some.

[StealYourFace]

Originally Posted by quality_sound

You have that so backwards it's not even funny. Typical American attitude that "our way is the only way". Only in America would someone buy an SUV when they need a wagon. Why the hell would someone buy an SUV, which would drive like a truck and get the mileage of a truck when a wagon will do EVERYTHING an SUV will drive better and get better mileage? There is almost NO reasons for ANYONE to buy an SUV since everything it does can be done, and done better, than something else.

Ford and Chevy did the best marketing job in history when they convinced Americans to forgo wagons in favor of big-ass SUVs. They were selling the Kool-Aid and you drank all of it and then some.

[slowSwede]

Agree on most aspects of the above backwards statement.
Some SUV's when going offroad does a pretty god job. But who really uses a SUV for that purpose?

I just wanted to put in a word of caution to the Op as for the Audi.
I've always liked Audi and thought of it as a comparable make to Bmw.
Last week I rented a A4 wagon tfsi model, and I didn't like it at all.
Cruise control had surges
Speedometer showed 13 km/h below real speed when set electronically at 139.
Disconnected drive feel.
Big drivers mirror blocking a lot of the view, but perhaps I was seated incorrectly in all fairness.
Ridiculous fuel consumption. My wifes e91 wagon (320) burns less fuel than that even the 335 get better numbers. And they're both 2007 models!

I was caught, during roughly 1 000 of the 1 400 kms spent in this car, thinking that Bmw's 3 years older feels 3 years younger compared to this car.

Do take the same model Audi for an extended test drive before making up your mind! I didn't notice a lot of these things driving away, but they dawned on me as I was driving.

Ohhh, a final thing!
The antiskid/stability control gets turned back on, when you have been driving for a while, I at least didn't find a way to permanently turn it off, but I didn't read the manual either so there might be a way.

[quality_sound]

What kind of mileage were you seeing? I had a 328iT for a weekend and never saw above 22-23MPG while I was easily into the mid-30s in an A4 Avant. Are you comparing the Audi to any Diesel BMWs?

[slowSwede]

Originally Posted by quality_sound

What kind of mileage were you seeing? I had a 328iT for a weekend and never saw above 22-23MPG while I was easily into the mid-30s in an A4 Avant. Are you comparing the Audi to any Diesel BMWs?

Would be a bit unfair to compare D to gasoline, so at least I didn't go there.

I got 28.4 in the Audi, and I was pretty conservative throttle wise.
One thing that might have affected is that you could run that car on ethanol or gasoline. I reset the computer when I filled her up, since the mpg's until then had been horrible, about 24 mpgs on the highway! Re-adaptation back to gasoline might have affected for a while.
Cruise control was used consistently and cruising speed was 132 km/h (82 mph).

The numbers on the 335 aren't that much better, but they are better by almost 1 mpg doing the same trip.

Perhaps something was wrong with that Audi, because I sure didn't expect that fuel consumption, paired with the other things.

I'll probably rent an Audi next time I need one, just to check if that's the Audi standard. I have driven Audi a lot of times previously, but I did loose a lot of respect after driving this specific car.

[quality_sound]

Originally Posted by Leprechaun

That's my point exactly. I put SUV and wagon in the same category and I would never drive one in my life time. Why don't you trade your BMW in for a Subaru? BMWs are for men, not fruit cakes who drive station wagons.

THAT is my point. SUVs and wagons are two totally different things. Are a car and a truck the same thing? Cuz that's what you're saying. SUVs are truck based, wagons are car based.

BMWs are for men? Did you REALLY just go there? What are you, 17? Go tell an RS6 Avant driver that he's a fruitcake and then watch him smoke you. Same goes for the M3 Touring and E55 AMG wagon.

Putting SUVs and wagons in the same category only shows your ignorance on the subject.

[Kikken]

Originally Posted by quality_sound

THAT is my point. SUVs and wagons are two totally different things. Are a car and a truck the same thing? Cuz that's what you're saying. SUVs are truck based, wagons are car based.

Well, that's not quite true anymore. Most SUV's (including the X3) are built on car-based unibodies.

Having said that, I'd take a 3-wagon over an X3 ANY day. For one, you can get a manual in the 3-wagon. In fact, I kinda wish I'd bought a 3-wagon instead of the e90.

But anyway, about the guy you responded to: either he's trolling or he's a complete idiot. Either way, best to ignore him.

[StealYourFace]

Originally Posted by Leprechaun

That's my point exactly. I put SUV and wagon in the same category and I would never drive one in my life time. Why don't you trade your BMW in for a Subaru? BMWs are for men, not fruit cakes who drive station wagons.

Fruit cake? Really?

Dick.

BMWs (or any car) are for everyone who wants to buy one, they aren't limited to anyone group or type of person. It's just a car, get over it.

[Alchem]

Unfortunately wagon sales are so low in the US, it is not worthwhile for BMW to pay so much money to get it crash tested and meet regulations. A 3GT would probably sell well or well enough. The new X3 design is soo boring. 3GT would be an alternative to the bland X3.

[darkcloud]

Originally Posted by Leprechaun

That's my point exactly. I put SUV and wagon in the same category and I would never drive one in my life time. Why don't you trade your BMW in for a Subaru? BMWs are for men, not fruit cakes who drive station wagons.

you must still be in high school. junior right? daddy just got you your 3? I'm sorry I know, "you worked so hard to get it all on your own"

when would you take any suv true off-roading? not just down some dirt road with bumps. if the suv isn't a wrangler, rover, or highly modified rig it's just some big gas guzzling thing that you should only need if you have 3+ kids and 2+ dogs. suv's arent necessary for most of the people who buy them, they just like the look, height or "safe feeling" they provide. otherwise remove the old school wagon perception you may have and realize that wagons and just as good as suv's.

Originally Posted by Alchem

Unfortunately wagon sales are so low in the US, it is not worthwhile for BMW to pay so much money to get it crash tested and meet regulations. A 3GT would probably sell well or well enough. The new X3 design is soo boring. 3GT would be an alternative to the bland X3.

the sales are low due to the fact of the above comment. wagons have a bad rap due to the shit wagons that were produced in the 70's and 80's by ford and chevy. they drove the market into the ground and came up with a new product, a jacked up wagon and called it an suv's and the hillbillies of America creamed themselves.

if BMW did some proper marketing for their wagons they would prolly sell fine,not suv level's but well enough to not drop them from our lineup. the 3GT will sell on the same level as the wagon. how long have the 5GT been out? couple months now, I've seen one on the road and it was a loaner. the wagons would be fine with some marketing and offering a proper lineup. if there was a 335 wagon you'd see those a lot.

[Tom K.]

Originally Posted by Leprechaun

That's my point exactly. I put SUV and wagon in the same category and I would never drive one in my life time. Why don't you trade your BMW in for a Subaru? BMWs are for men, not fruit cakes who drive station wagons.

It seems to me that ignoring the troll is preferable to feeding him.

Tom

[woodpecka]

Just travel a litle bit in Europe and anybody will understand that Touring car (yeah Wagon) are very sexy. There, saloon are for old peoples.

[Hops128i]

How the general public here in the US, finds a top heavy, sloppy handling, clunky looking suv/crossover 'cooler' than a sports sedan based wagon has to be one of the great mysteries of the universe.

[woodpecka]

Originally Posted by Hops128i

How the general public here in the US, finds a top heavy, sloppy handling, clunky looking suv/crossover 'cooler' than a sports sedan based wagon has to be one of the great mysteries of the universe.

[Touring]

Originally Posted by Leprechaun

That's my point exactly. I put SUV and wagon in the same category and I would never drive one in my life time. Why don't you trade your BMW in for a Subaru? BMWs are for men, not fruit cakes who drive station wagons.

I guess im a ûber-fruitcake

[quality_sound]

These guys must be fruitcakes too. This was at the Ring in September, I think. Since it's a little blurry, those are RS6 Avants.

[slowSwede]

Another fruitcake calling in...Sweden and Norway must have an abnormal concentration of fruitcakes.