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BMW X1 (F48) and X2 (F39) Forums General BMW X1 Forum (F48) Introducing the BMW X1 xDrive25e PHEV – followed by the BMW X2 xDrive25e

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      01-09-2020, 11:50 PM   #23
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These models are going to be very popular. The 2 series Active Tourer (van) has been around in this configuration for years and if you look at the used 225's in Germany about a third is 225i and two thirds is 225xe (PHEV). Many of those who buy this vehicle don't buy it for the driving dynamics of a BMW but because it is a BMW.

Last summer I went to see the BMW plant in Leipzig where the 2 series Active Tourer is build and a fairly good share of the 2 ATs were PHEVs. Since the new 1 series is built on the same platform in the same plant I am sure it is just a matter of time before BMW announces a 125xe and a 225xe Gran Coupe.
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      01-10-2020, 02:47 PM   #24
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What does this offer that I can't get on a loaded Niro plugin instead? BMW claims to be the ultimate driving machine but it is loading up its hybrids with economy models.

I have a friend who is replacing a BMW X5 with a Hyundai Pallisade because he thinks it is at least as good a car for a lot less. If BMW wants to sell premium performance cars, it must actually do that.

BUT...I am sure it will sell a boatload of them no matter what I think.
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      01-10-2020, 09:26 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Feddersen View Post
These models are going to be very popular.
Not being rude, but speaking from Denmark I can see your unconscientious influenced perception. Of course if they force you to do so, IS POPULAR!
Denmark has proposed a ban on the sale of new petrol and diesel cars from 2030 and hybrid from 2035, "joining international efforts to promote electric-only vehicles to reduce air pollution and combat climate change."
And as a note: I NEVER heard someone saying that Active Tourer is beautiful or popular! "Ugly" was a compliment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Feddersen View Post
Many of those who buy this vehicle don't buy it for the driving dynamics of a BMW but because it is a BMW.
No, they bought it because the tax relief or overtax.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KoenG View Post
That's because you live in the US and probably don't mind... yet. As from NOW the average CO2 emission for the cars sold by a car manufacturer in Europe has to undercut 95gr/km. This equals an average consumption of about 60 miles per gallon.
Oh, yes. Merkel, environmentalists, ignorants, the green hidden agenda and the new CO2 tax grabbing... Higher and higher taxes will be used to get the public to “voluntarily” reduce their transportation choices.
Freedom much? Saying something doesn't make it so... Let me decide if I want it and let the product prove that is better.
Watch out for all new policies affecting every aspect of our lives, using environmental protection simply as the excuse to squeeze our emotions and get us to voluntarily surrender our liberties.
Sad... Very sad...
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      01-10-2020, 11:39 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
Not being rude, but speaking from Denmark I can see your unconscientious influenced perception. Of course if they force you to do so, IS POPULAR!
Denmark has proposed a ban on the sale of new petrol and diesel cars from 2030 and hybrid from 2035, "joining international efforts to promote electric-only vehicles to reduce air pollution and combat climate change."
And as a note: I NEVER heard someone saying that Active Tourer is beautiful or popular! "Ugly" was a compliment.


No, they bought it because the tax relief or overtax.


Oh, yes. Merkel, environmentalists, ignorants, the green hidden agenda and the new CO2 tax grabbing... Higher and higher taxes will be used to get the public to “voluntarily” reduce their transportation choices.
Freedom much? Saying something doesn't make it so... Let me decide if I want it and let the product prove that is better.
Watch out for all new policies affecting every aspect of our lives, using environmental protection simply as the excuse to squeeze our emotions and get us to voluntarily surrender our liberties.
Sad... Very sad...
First of all a single small left wing party or two have proposed a ban as a part of the election campaign last year. It is not the government. Secondly you can't put Denmark into any BMW equation since we have so high taxes on cars in general. This makes BMW, Audi, Mercedes rare cars and the high taxes apply to the hybrids as well. Only full electric cars really benefit from tax reductions. So regardless what there will never be many BMWs in Denmark.

If you look the 2AT it is one of the most sold BMWs in Germany and the reason for that is not because of the driving dynamics but because there is a segment of buyers who want the brand and the luxury feel and have the need for a van. The X1 is the most sold BMW model worldwide. This is simply because buyers like it and I guess 99% of all buyers are not enthusiast but simple car buyers. Back when the i3 was introduced I noticed a group of young people looking at cars at BMW Welt. When they saw the i3, they were amazed and they loved it because of choice of materials and connectivity. This group simply had a completely different focus on what’s smart and what’s not (and they had never driven a car). The success and support for i3, 2AT and X1 has absolutely nothing to do with taxes or environmental focus. It is because there is a worldwide demand for them and because BMW is trying to earn money where they can. And once they will not make money on V8’s anymore they will stop making them. Just look at the Z4. They needed Toyota in order to get enough volume because the model itself could not make any income. That is simply how business works regardless of what some car enthusiast say and that is why the X1/X2 XE models will be popular.
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      01-11-2020, 07:22 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tracus View Post
Not being rude, but speaking from Denmark I can see your unconscientious influenced perception. Of course if they force you to do so, IS POPULAR!
Denmark has proposed a ban on the sale of new petrol and diesel cars from 2030 and hybrid from 2035, "joining international efforts to promote electric-only vehicles to reduce air pollution and combat climate change."
And as a note: I NEVER heard someone saying that Active Tourer is beautiful or popular! "Ugly" was a compliment.


No, they bought it because the tax relief or overtax.


Oh, yes. Merkel, environmentalists, ignorants, the green hidden agenda and the new CO2 tax grabbing... Higher and higher taxes will be used to get the public to “voluntarily” reduce their transportation choices.
Freedom much? Saying something doesn't make it so... Let me decide if I want it and let the product prove that is better.
Watch out for all new policies affecting every aspect of our lives, using environmental protection simply as the excuse to squeeze our emotions and get us to voluntarily surrender our liberties.
Sad... Very sad...
"Ignorants"?
Look at the charts of global warming of the last four decades and then we can discuss again what is an ignorant. It's January and our skiing regions suffer from missing snow like never before. Outside it's five degrees and should be minus five. Cold Sibirian air soon no longer makes it to reach us.
"Liberties"?
I feel not limited with my CO2 free heater, my vegetarian diet and my two i-cars. I feel good... but not very good, because I see what's happening in Australia. That's what is sad, very very sad!

But sorry for OT. I'm happy to see the i8 hybrid concept in its latest incarnation in this X cars. Having the instant torque of an electric motor at hand is pure pleasure. It's a fresh, all new driving experience.
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      01-11-2020, 09:57 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveinArizona View Post
What does this offer that I can't get on a loaded Niro plugin instead? BMW claims to be the ultimate driving machine but it is loading up its hybrids with economy models.

I have a friend who is replacing a BMW X5 with a Hyundai Pallisade because he thinks it is at least as good a car for a lot less. If BMW wants to sell premium performance cars, it must actually do that.

BUT...I am sure it will sell a boatload of them no matter what I think.
BMW sell 2.5 mm vehicle a year and in most countries outside North America starts with much smaller engine...
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      01-12-2020, 01:32 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigT View Post
"Ignorants"?
Look at the charts of global warming of the last four decades and then we can discuss again what is an ignorant. It's January and our skiing regions suffer from missing snow like never before. Outside it's five degrees and should be minus five. Cold Sibirian air soon no longer makes it to reach us.
"Liberties"?
I feel not limited with my CO2 free heater, my vegetarian diet and my two i-cars. I feel good... but not very good, because I see what's happening in Australia. That's what is sad, very very sad!

But sorry for OT. I'm happy to see the i8 hybrid concept in its latest incarnation in this X cars. Having the instant torque of an electric motor at hand is pure pleasure. It's a fresh, all new driving experience.
Check weather history for the last 200 years. It is largely available. If you dig enough, you can find weather records even from few hundreds years ago. The fact that we have reached a high level of communication, hence a fast way to tell about the weird snow in Mexico or Africa, it means a lot for the one that doesn't read more. Stop buying your politicians agenda. The globe is fine, is just change that happened all the time. There were time of heavy snow and heavy droughts in history, all out of the normal pattern and happened in times when the cars did not even existed or they were as rare as a panda bear. There were cooling periods in 1650, 1770, 1850, all with warm periods in between.
It seems that you are listening too much to the Hollywood ignorants? Or "super intelligent" Greta?


No wonder Ricky Gervais hit them hard in every aspect as they are a bunch of ignorant hypocrites that live in their little world...
I applaud him for a such speech!


Bottom line, is all about perception: but vegetarian diet might not be as good as you think, the electric vehicle might not be that ethical, that green and not even that healthy, etc.
The information is all there -and plenty- if you want to read it and explore it. You can embrace what they want you to, or you can explore and widen your knowledge portfolio. Nobody stops you to read, analyze and reach your own rationale.

In the end, electric car or ICE car, I would like to have the choice to decide for myself, based on my own knowledge and my own rationale. I am against any person, government or corporation that opposes the freedom of choice, to either me or you. And the new taxation is not about the planet or you health, is about their agenda.
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      01-12-2020, 07:16 AM   #30
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WTF??? The same horror knob from old 2.5d
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      01-12-2020, 09:55 AM   #31
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Some thoughts:

1) Why oh why were the interiors not updated? Those gage clusters and e.g. shifter look super dated by now. Same way they hobbled the otherwise superb looking 7 series...

2) the closeups of the badging show dreadful paint orange peel effect. I was quite disappointed to see that on my new 330e. A car of the prices BMW charges should have better paint. My previous Volvos were much better in that regard.

3) I Dont know where BMW gets those ev ranges. Even with careful driving, the 330e never drops below 18-20 KWh/100 km. I assume because, unlike with Tesla, the electric motor goes through a gearbox. Moreover, the full 12KWh of battery are not available for driving it seems, with a sizeable top and bottom buffer (to protect the battery against aging?). 20 KWh/100 km with 12 KWh battery should get me 60 km, even considering HVAC power draw, it would seem not all of the battery is really available: on a good day I get 40-42 km out of it, not the quoted 40 miles (I.e. 66 or so km)

That being said, in Hybrid mode, some 12000 km's in, average fuel consumption is only 4,1 l/100 km which is way better than the small Diesels still popular in Europe. All that while not really changing my driving habits and easily pulling away from idiots trying to tailgate on the highways in XBoost mode
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      01-12-2020, 10:03 AM   #32
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My wife has driven a Chevy Volt for the last 3 years and while it has more range (53 and regularly can pull 60+), generally she needs less than half that for day to day. She gets gas quarterly and that's really only if we end up taking her car on a trip, but we're averaging about 3800mi on 9 gallons of gas.

If you don't have a big commute, you'd be surprised how far 30mi really is.
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      01-12-2020, 12:47 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveinArizona View Post
I drive a 530e but it seems to me that BMW is trying to compete with the Prius. Driving a BMW should be fun and they are peddling underpowered hybrids. If that is all I care about, I won't buy a BMW!

BMW needs to learn the lesson from Porsche. If you are a performance brand, you need to sell performance automobiles. For Porsche, the PHEV in the Panamera family is the top of the line, not the underpowered bottom.

Shame.
That said, the top of the line Panamera Turbo Hybrid is slower than an M5C, so it seems the so called hybrid performance add-ons actually reduced the performance.

I’d rather then have it on the low end of the spectrum, for fuel economy.
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      01-12-2020, 02:29 PM   #34
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If you believe there is global warming then China and India are the problems not the US where emissions are declining. Why sign agreements when the biggest problem China keeps building coal plants. Send Hanoi Jane over to China to protest and see how that goes.
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      01-12-2020, 03:54 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucky13 View Post
If you believe there is global warming then China and India are the problems not the US where emissions are declining. Why sign agreements when the biggest problem China keeps building coal plants. Send Hanoi Jane over to China to protest and see how that goes.
That may be true that China and India are worse offenders. But so what, that is such a low bar to clear.

It doesn't constitute a reason for countries like the US to slacken their commitment. It simply doesn't work like that, and if you don't understand this simple idea then we're all doomed.

The US must lead by example, and constantly encourage others to follow suit. That's what being a "shiny beacon" entails. The leader doesn't stop leading just because a few others are falling behind.


Or else you'd rather burn the house down with you in it?
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      01-13-2020, 08:51 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by adc View Post
That said, the top of the line Panamera Turbo Hybrid is slower than an M5C, so it seems the so called hybrid performance add-ons actually reduced the performance.

I’d rather then have it on the low end of the spectrum, for fuel economy.
It may be a matter of perspective. I see you are driving an M3. Would you say that if the car were your only car?

We are a one car family so my perspective is what I want and for me it is to protect the environment while still providing driving excitement.
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      01-13-2020, 04:49 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveinArizona View Post
It may be a matter of perspective. I see you are driving an M3. Would you say that if the car were your only car?

We are a one car family so my perspective is what I want and for me it is to protect the environment while still providing driving excitement.
My point is, by adding a battery, power electronics and electric motors to a car like the M3 (or Panamera), the environment wasn't saved, and performance didn't increase. It's pointless the way porsche implemented it...

Quite honestly if we were a one car family I'd go for a Tesla Model Y or model 3.
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      01-23-2020, 01:46 PM   #38
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Are these X1/2 25e models only available in Euro?
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      01-25-2020, 11:13 AM   #39
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Looks like it. They are not announced in the US press room.

The German configurator has them now and there a no special options at all.
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      01-25-2020, 06:04 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveinArizona View Post
What does this offer that I can't get on a loaded Niro plugin instead? BMW claims to be the ultimate driving machine but it is loading up its hybrids with economy models.

I have a friend who is replacing a BMW X5 with a Hyundai Pallisade because he thinks it is at least as good a car for a lot less. If BMW wants to sell premium performance cars, it must actually do that.

BUT...I am sure it will sell a boatload of them no matter what I think.

I've hired the Hyundai equivalent of the Niro (remember, they're essentially the same company and car)... the Kona is quite a nice car to drive and has a lot of kit as standard. However, it's very cheap and plasticy inside, nowhere near the quality of a BMW.

I'm waiting to see what kind of X1 hybrid I can get on my company car scheme - it'll be a choice between the X1 25e or the 330e MSport for me.
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      09-26-2020, 12:46 AM   #41
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Talking bmw always the best

I am so excited when bmw x12019 is out! The redesigned BMW X1 2019 is awesome! Because it has always had only one version after 2016 until last year.
I am a big fan of it. But what I feel a little unhappy is that recently someone has always compared it with the Peugeot 3008 Allure Plus, which has similar body size and almost the same engine capacity. Which one do you think is better, BMW X1 sDrive18i xLine or Peugeot 3008 Allure Plus? ? ? , Anyway, I firmly choose bmw! !
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      10-09-2020, 10:26 AM   #42
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Why not a digital instrument cluster?

Why don't they include a fully digital instrument cluster for F48 like the BMW 318i, X3, X5...etc?
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      10-09-2020, 05:19 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thilinadg View Post
Why don't they include a fully digital instrument cluster for F48 like the BMW 318i, X3, X5...etc?
I am not sure whether you are talking about the instrument cluster directly in front of the driver or not.

Fully digital is in later BMW's and is the iDrive 7. For the F48 it would necessitate a complete hardware change (and possible redesign in the car), because it has iDrive 6.

Having said that my UK 2020 LCI xDrive 2.0i M Sport has a full black panel instrument cluster.
I do not know if the earlier f48 2015 to 2019 has a black panel or analog instrument cluster. Perhaps this may be different for different countries.?
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Last edited by Peter_R; 10-09-2020 at 05:32 PM..
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      10-10-2020, 01:52 AM   #44
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I think a "full digital cluster" refers to the new G (and other) series flat panel behind the steering wheel, which can be user configured. Both our 2013 F20 M135i and 2016 F48 X have a "black panel display" (as defined in the BMW sales blurb of the day), which is a smallish OLED(?) rectangle between the (analogue) tachometer and speedometer. This display varies somewhat according to need (nav instructions, music track, various trip computer data) but is pretty basic.
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