[carnuts3]

Originally Posted by RichReg

Finally, someone has added a sensible theory to all of this ridiculous conjecture.

The rest of all of you are just fantasizing;;;there is no way a 300hp 3 Series is going to be cheap, ESPECIALLY if its the two-door shown in the spy photo.

Dream on.

It's not just an issue of affordability. It's also an issue of practicality. Most can't experience the full potential of these M cars day-to-day on the city streets. As a result, it's a waste of money for most to own these cars; a cheaper alternative is much desired for most. With the savings that you would have spent on the M car you can start saving for your kids college education, or go on a great vacation, or do both.

[RichReg]

Originally Posted by greginaz1

I'd actually like to see it be like $5K more and decked out with ZHP like package goodies...

You crack me up.....now you actually want it to cost more?
Guys like yourself who bought the ZHP and paid the extra $$$ are
the exact reason why your pricing scheme could actually see reality.

We'll see soon enough....

[ABR]

I would not wait.

I waited 6 mo for Lexus IS, which turns into something that doesn't suit me. I would buy only "real" car. Future deposits are stupid things to do.

[RichReg]

Originally Posted by user1

The 6 series started using the i designation instead of Ci. The 5 & 7 series continues to use the i designation. But all three lines only have coupes or sedans (wagon in 5) in their line. But the 3 series spans the coupe and sedan. So making a 335i that’s both a coupe and sedan would be extremely confusing and not in BMWs history. As far as I remember there has always been a designation from BMW to differentiate the coupe from the sedan in the 3 series line (the line that combines the two vehicles).

So, my theory is the 335i may only be available in coupe form (at least initially for the first year). A sedan 335i would be a repeating moniker in the 3 series line. As seen in the photo the 335i will be the new coupe and possibly the 330i will remain in sedan form. Maybe no 335 sedan in the near future.

Sounds plausible.....maybe the 335 sedan will be the 335Si? ...or 330Si?

[user1]

People are talking about pricing the 335 coupe at the same price as the e46M3. Just because the new e90M3 is supposed to go upscale/more expensive people automatically think the core 3 series line should also go upscale. The thing we aren’t taking it consideration is that the ability for US consumers to afford these vehicles hasn’t gone up dramatically. Most people weren’t shelling out for the e46 M3's price so why would they shell out the same price only a year later for a regular 3 series with close HP? Its not like it has any more of the M components, just a close number of horses.

My guess is a 335i (in any form) won’t be as much as an e46 M3. All guess say the 335 coupe wont have the HP of the e46 M3 (also a coupe) and we all know it wont have the suspension & components. So why would it have a close price? Just because it has close HP? Nonsense. There is more to the e46 M3 than HP and pricing a regular 3 series near an e46M3 would not make sense.

With the 335 only increasing HP to be equal to (maybe a couple horses above) the competition, BMW would be foolish to price the model so far above the competition that it would not even be in the same league (price-wise). Remember the G35 is only $31K MSRP and a BMW coupe based on e46 prices would already be at $37K. BMW is already $6K more before any 335 price increases. BMW being the best (better than a G35) isn’t an argument here because they need to price it to the masses, not to BMW fanatics. The masses don’t really know the nuances that make BMW better. Only that BMW is better so $6K may be an acceptable stretch. But $7,8,9 or $10K more and you’ve lost the masses.

I do think 335 will increase over the 330, just not to e46 M3 prices.

[StevoSEA]

first of all I agree about m-series being special. My point is that a335i or what ever will be much more expensive than a 330i is today. My BMW sources are people who have seen the sales or have been a part of the transactions (the 25k-45k is for an msrp 82 to 87k m5) and yes people, very silly people in socal are paying these prices. Also the point about the e46 w/performance package was to show how BMW priced that HP package and how large the demand was-even though the e46 was in its 5th year. also from my own shopping experiences in 2004 when the 645 coupe came out the dealers were marking them up 10-15k I saw that for myself and each and every one were already sold. Living where I do in Southern Calif, I have no fewer than 8 BMW dealerships in a 25mi radius to browse the new BMW entries and see for myself what is real (price wise and what is bogus)

[StevoSEA]

exactly right

[lux.sh]

Originally Posted by ABR

I would not wait.

I waited 6 mo for Lexus IS, which turns into something that doesn't suit me. I would buy only "real" car. Future deposits are stupid things to do.

but this is BMW though.

[0700700]

dumb question. who would buy a car if he knew it was discountinued

[ABR]

Originally Posted by lux.sh

but this is BMW though.

Lux, since when do you became such a BMW funboy?

You never know if you'd like the car, until you test drive it, regardless the brand.

[Bob T]

Originally Posted by 0700700

dumb question. who would buy a car if he knew it was discountinued

Every car will be discontinued at some point. So I guess one should never buy since another model will come along.

[torzeck]

Personally I am dissappointed. I think it stinks that you buy the first year car and then the manufacturer makes it obsolete with a signifigant upgrade. I would have thought my 2006 would have stayed basically the same for a few years.I think it makes it even worse that with BMW you order the car when you don't know the future and then midway through the wait the Manufacturer upgrades the car. Meanwhile you have sold your car to be replaced and are SOL{yes I guess you can cancel but...}.

My hope is the sedan does not receive the upgrade with the coupe and BMW waits.

[user1]

Originally Posted by torzeck

Personally I am dissappointed. I think it stinks that you buy the first year car and then the manufacturer makes it obsolete with a signifigant upgrade. I would have thought my 2006 would have stayed basically the same for a few years.I think it makes it even worse that with BMW you order the car when you don't know the future and then midway through the wait the Manufacturer upgrades the car. Meanwhile you have sold your car to be replaced and are SOL{yes I guess you can cancel but...}.

My hope is the sedan does not receive the upgrade with the coupe and BMW waits.

As I stated earlier, I think its a possibility the sedan wont get the refresh right away.

Historically its not unheard of that BMW does an engine refresh early in a new models life. The last generation (e46) received an engine refresh 2 years in. The sedan will have been out for a year and a half by Sept06 so an engine refresh would only be 6 months earlier than what they did with the e46. So the sedan refresh should be expected and shouldn’t be a shock to anyone who follows BMW history. After all, we are talking about 18 month engine refresh versus 24 month refresh. I understand your frustration & I’m not trying to rude in writing this - only stating historical facts.

[0700700]

Originally Posted by Bob T

Every car will be discontinued at some point. So I guess one should never buy since another model will come along.

not if it is discountinued in 5 years time thou

[voltron1011]

Originally Posted by Pretender

Talking about horsepower?
Did people jump to buy 1998/1999 Acura TL (225HP), Lexus ES300 (200-210 HP), Accord V6 (200HP), Camry V6 (194 HP) or Maxima V6 (222HP) instead of BMW 328 (190-193HP)/323 (168-170HP)?
r???)

Good point Pretender....

[akhbhaat]

Originally Posted by user1

The 6 series started using the i designation instead of Ci. The 5 & 7 series continues to use the i designation. But all three lines only have coupes or sedans (wagon in 5) in their line. But the 3 series spans the coupe and sedan. So making a 335i that’s both a coupe and sedan would be extremely confusing and not in BMWs history. As far as I remember there has always been a designation from BMW to differentiate the coupe from the sedan in the 3 series line (the line that combines the two vehicles).

So, my theory is the 335i may only be available in coupe form (at least initially for the first year). A sedan 335i would be a repeating moniker in the 3 series line. As seen in the photo the 335i will be the new coupe and possibly the 330i will remain in sedan form. Maybe no 335 sedan in the near future.

You're basing that entire theory off the idea that people will be "confused" by a simple badge change? People are stupid, but not that stupid. Even a chimpanzee could tell the difference between two doors and four.

Just for the sake of reference, the E46 convertibles and coupes used the same badge lettering...completely different cars. Meanwhile, the RWD and AWD wagons used the same "i" and "xi" designations as the sedans (the "it" designation you see was NEVER used on the back of the cars themselves - just in unofficial sales literature, and still only sporadically even then). In fact, the wagons STILL share the same designations as the sedans. Were people "confused" then?

[lux.sh]

Originally Posted by ABR

Lux, since when do you became such a BMW funboy?

You never know if you'd like the car, until you test drive it, regardless the brand.

lol. I always loved BMWs. I have NO idea what you are talking about.

Honestly, being a huge BMW fanboy, I think I'll like any BMWs designed for performance. Yes, I would put down a deposit for upcoming bmw without even seeing it nor testing drive it.

You see, thats the difference. With japanese cars, I would NEVER buy it without test driving it. With bmw, there is a trust.
I do NOT trust the way they design cup holders though.

[akhbhaat]

Originally Posted by torzeck

Personally I am dissappointed. I think it stinks that you buy the first year car and then the manufacturer makes it obsolete with a signifigant upgrade. I would have thought my 2006 would have stayed basically the same for a few years.I think it makes it even worse that with BMW you order the car when you don't know the future and then midway through the wait the Manufacturer upgrades the car. Meanwhile you have sold your car to be replaced and are SOL{yes I guess you can cancel but...}.

My hope is the sedan does not receive the upgrade with the coupe and BMW waits.

Most of the Japanese models refresh completely every 3 to 4 years - that is, a completely new body/chassis/interior and engine lineup. The first and second generation Acura CL, for example, were only produced for three model years apiece.

A simple engine change doesn't obsolete your car. My daily driver is a late production second year E46 with one of the "old" engines, and it's been mistaken for a late production model more times than I can count.

Who knows, BMW might do something awful to the new cars: like, say, get rid of the brilliant, responsive cable driven electro-mechanical throttle and replace it with some awful tripe like drive-by-wire...or, worse, crank up the power steering boost and ruin the car's lauded steering feel and response in the process. Sound far fetched? That's EXACTLY what happened when BMW trasitioned the E46 line into the 2001 model year... (unfortunately, you're stuck with DBW as it's been in every BMW car since then...but the E90's steering is far better than the crap they put in the 2001 E46)

I've never once regretted buying this car. I could've gone for the 2001 cars and gotten a negligible boost in HP or even the 330...but then I'd be dealing with the crappy first year DBW throttle and the Ultimate Parking Machine steering. Or, I could've waited until 2002, but then I'd have had to buy the ugly facelifted sedan and I would STILL have had DBW. We didn't know at the time whether or not BMW ever would return the car's steering to what it should be.

[lux.sh]

Originally Posted by akhbhaat

Ultimate Parking Machine

I like that one!!!!!!!! BMW. Ultimate Parking Machine.

[davinet78]

get the car now and dont worry about whats coming out in the future

[akhbhaat]

Originally Posted by lux.sh

I like that one!!!!!!!! BMW. Ultimate Parking Machine.

Ever driven a 2001 car with the boosted steering? Do yourself a favor and do so if you ever get the chance. It's like driving a Lexus - and you'll appreciate your own car that much more afterwards.

[gohawks23]

Originally Posted by RichReg

You crack me up.....now you actually want it to cost more?
Guys like yourself who bought the ZHP and paid the extra $$$ are
the exact reason why your pricing scheme could actually see reality.

We'll see soon enough....

Personally, $ really isn't a concern...plus $5K more would make it a little less popular on the streets ...I'm in an 03 ZHP now and have absolutely ZERO reason or desire to move to the existing E90 330...a 335 might tempt me but I'd like an M style air dam...short shifter...M wheel...M style wheels...M 'tuning'...etc.