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      12-07-2021, 05:21 AM   #881
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium View Post
It's not necessary for HAM to shave the walls with millimeters to gain time and speed .
Shaving walls requires b@lls and HAM is too chicken anyway ..
HAM's Mercedes RocketShip pulled him to the pole ..Relaxed !
Quote:
Originally Posted by F87source View Post
This is the mentality that costs championships that could've been wrapped up long ago.
You edited my post , that makes that your statement makes sense ...

Same way .Just like Mercedes is cheating with HAM's Rocket PU.

Well done mate !
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      12-07-2021, 05:48 AM   #882
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium View Post
You edited my post , that makes that your statement makes sense ...

Same way .Just like Mercedes is cheating with HAM's Rocket PU.

Well done mate !
They just don't want to see it and it affects all the other teams too who keep quiet b/c of Merc supply of PU's,they have stranglehold on them and even Hill said at one time Merc should GTFO of F1.
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      12-07-2021, 09:15 AM   #883
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubbles View Post
Here are a few screen grabs of Lap 43. Conceptually I don’t view this as a problem but FIA can’t dish out penalties for this sometimes and do nothing for largely identical situations. It’s gotta cut both ways, my preference is to let them race.

Masi FIA race director Michael Masi said that was “borderline black-and-white warning flag” moment. Yet he did nothing, dude is in over his head.
IMO the issue lies with modern track design.
Bring back the gravel traps & problem solved w/o rules intervention.
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      12-07-2021, 09:44 AM   #884
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium View Post
Listen mate ...
MAX got the order to let HAM by .We know that .. Fine !

"BUT"
Let HAM by in a strategic manner !
"Strategic manner" = RB code to play DRS games to trick HAM.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium View Post
...
Both (HAM and MAX) they were aware, the DRS zone was coming on the straight ..
Agreed, and no rule against MAX playing this game and I'm OK with this.
But there is also no rule that HAM has to take the pass where RB dictates.
HAM perfectly within his rights to wait until after DRS line.
Rules do not dictate where the place must be given back.

This was a case of HAM understanding RB tricks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium View Post
What followed was : "The Roadrunner" !
Do you understand ?
Wrong...
What followed is MAX got red mist because his DRS line trick didn't work
and then Max did his erratic acceleration and then brake check.

Once again Max's hot head got him in trouble.
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      12-07-2021, 10:12 AM   #885
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inTgr8r View Post
"Strategic manner" = RB code to play DRS games to trick HAM.


Agreed, and no rule against MAX playing this game and I'm OK with this.
But there is also no rule that HAM has to take the pass where RB dictates.
HAM perfectly within his rights to wait until after DRS line.
Rules do not dictate where the place must be given back.

This was a case of HAM understanding RB tricks.


Wrong...
What followed is MAX got red mist because his DRS line trick didn't work
and then Max did his erratic acceleration and then brake check.

Once again Max's hot head got him in trouble.
Nah you got it all wrong,Ham had his chance to get past that's why Max accelerated and then braked wondering what the hell he is playing at when he didn't go past as he had to let him past,drs zone or not.
Max was a victim of dumbo director who misread the situation and as said before he needs to go.
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      12-07-2021, 10:48 AM   #886
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M5Rick View Post
Nah you got it all wrong,Ham had his chance to get past that's why Max accelerated and then braked wondering what the hell he is playing at when he didn't go past as he had to let him past,drs zone or not.
Max was a victim of dumbo director who misread the situation and as said before he needs to go.
you really are hilarious
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      12-07-2021, 11:00 AM   #887
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inTgr8r View Post
you really are hilarious
Dickie sits around for hours thinking of ways how he can try and spin things, he actually knows his comments are wrong, but we all know the definition of insanity.

I am a troll, I know it but Dickie is the Emperor of Trolling.
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      12-07-2021, 11:05 AM   #888
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Ham’s race IQ is sooo high. Pretty funny that he’s fooled his haters into believing that he is just frolicking around the track with no idea what’s actually going on, yet (among many things) manages to get through entire races with Max driving at him like an iracing rookie classer (which I love btw).

I am just greatful we have both of them for some very different talent and amazing racing action, unlike the high and mighty snobs who want the cleanest racing with no drama, and constantly want penalties. I hope they never have a say in governing F1.
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      12-07-2021, 11:12 AM   #889
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crimson92 View Post
Yeah but the sudden acceleration and sudden deceleration line is max so I don't really see the point you're trying to make.

It clearly shows max accelerated then hard braked.
Listen mate ...
MAX got the order to let HAM by .We know that .. Fine !

"BUT"
Let HAM by in a strategic manner !

In other words :
Both (HAM and MAX) they were aware, the DRS zone was coming on the straight ..
To get and to keep P2 was the key there !

What followed was : "The Roadrunner" !
Do you understand ?

Of course they were both aware. No one is arguing that.

Explain why max brake checked ?

You can't. It was a dick move.

Moving on.
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      12-07-2021, 11:40 AM   #890
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At least Max has the balls to fight Hamilton and Bottas while the rest of the grid (except Alonso) lets them go by without a fight. Looking forward to Sunday.
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      12-07-2021, 11:55 AM   #891
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulo_f80m3 View Post
At least Max has the balls to fight Hamilton and Bottas while the rest of the grid (except Alonso) lets them go by without a fight. Looking forward to Sunday.
Max should be willing to fight Hamilton, but within the confines of the rules. Being willing to consistently and blatantly break the rules to fight Hamilton is not an honorable trait. A boxer attempting to become championship by head kicking his opponent then declaring "at least I have the balls to fight the champ!" is a fool.

It's already been mentioned, but Max squandered away the opportunity to already have won the championship and he wouldn't have needed to resort to so much dirty driving to accomplish that task.
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      12-07-2021, 11:58 AM   #892
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbarton62 View Post
Dickie sits around for hours thinking of ways how he can try and spin things, he actually knows his comments are wrong, but we all know the definition of insanity.

I am a troll, I know it but Dickie is the Emperor of Trolling.
Nice of U to admit you're a troll Barty even though you know little heheh
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      12-07-2021, 12:04 PM   #893
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StatenEye View Post
But I didn't vote, I'm confused...

When you win championships, you don't bother with awards and prizes that don't really matter in the end... Retrospectively no one will look back at driver awards, they will look at championships.
You are free to vote on some F1 sites when the race is finishing,I do it on F1 it's easy.
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      12-07-2021, 12:07 PM   #894
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M2CS View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulo_f80m3 View Post
At least Max has the balls to fight Hamilton and Bottas while the rest of the grid (except Alonso) lets them go by without a fight. Looking forward to Sunday.
Max should be willing to fight Hamilton, but within the confines of the rules. Being willing to consistently and blatantly break the rules to fight Hamilton is not an honorable trait. A boxer attempting to become championship by head kicking his opponent then declaring "at least I have the balls to fight the champ!" is a fool.

It's already been mentioned, but Max squandered away the opportunity to already have won the championship and he wouldn't have needed to resort to so much dirty driving to accomplish that task.
You're right but it's so awesome to watch. Much better than seeing one car in front by half a lap and falling asleep mid race. This goes back to F1 being what it's always been unfortunately. 2 teams or drivers fighting for championships. That's what's wrong with this sport. The day F1 has 6 or 7 drivers going into the final weekend with a chance to win the championship would be a dream.
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      12-07-2021, 12:14 PM   #895
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulo_f80m3 View Post
You're right but it's so awesome to watch. Much better than seeing one car in front by half a lap and falling asleep mid race. This goes back to F1 being what it's always been unfortunately. 2 teams or drivers fighting for championships. That's what's wrong with this sport. The day F1 has 6 or 7 drivers going into the final weekend with a chance to win the championship would be a dream.
A driver doing a lot of dirty driving isn't what's needed to make the races more exciting. For me, most MotoGP seasons are more exciting because the riders can stay close to each other and constantly battle for the lead. Due to the aero in F1, it's difficult to stay close to each other so that makes it harder to give the fans exciting battles. Hopefully the new cars coming next year will make it easier for multiple cars to battle in close formation.
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      12-07-2021, 12:40 PM   #896
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FormulaMMM View Post
Believe impact occurs at the moment of sudden acceleration, ~5300 mark.

He speeds up then slows for the corner where you indicate brake check.
Indeed this is true.


Quote:
Originally Posted by inTgr8r View Post
what a joke^
You really do need to learn how to read telemetry data


...
Where you highlight your 'brake check', it's where Max brakes for the next corner. You can also see that in the previous lap (lap36) where both Max and HAM brake at the exact rate, and at the exact spot.

Also, the supposedly "speeding up before the brake check" doesn't show on the multiple video feeds. Because from your points highlighted on the graph, that speeding up would have been from 100 to 200kph; which would either mean a doubling of the revs or shifting up 1 or 2 times. Both dont happen as can be seen in the video feeds.
Also that "speeding up before the brake check" would have happened over a stretch over 100M. Not seen on video.
The crash happened at 5300m.
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      12-07-2021, 01:01 PM   #897
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Honestly you couldn’t make it up, the entire rest of the field said that the move in Brazil shouldn’t have been allowed and should have been sanctioned but nope the FIA and the stewards left it even post race.

Today we get the interview below. Basically he did drive Lewis off the circuit in Brazil and it was fine, I did the same in Jeddah and I get punished what gives.

Sorry didn’t we all say it wasn’t clear, so basically both moves should have been punished. Ah well onto the final chapter of the season.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/v...razil/6858307/
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      12-07-2021, 02:16 PM   #898
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuidoK View Post
Indeed this is true.

Where you highlight your 'brake check', it's where Max brakes for the next corner. You can also see that in the previous lap (lap36) where both Max and HAM brake at the exact rate, and at the exact spot.

Also, the supposedly "speeding up before the brake check" doesn't show on the multiple video feeds. Because from your points highlighted on the graph, that speeding up would have been from 100 to 200kph; which would either mean a doubling of the revs or shifting up 1 or 2 times. Both dont happen as can be seen in the video feeds.
Also that "speeding up before the brake check" would have happened over a stretch over 100M. Not seen on video.
The crash happened at 5300m.
Yes, impact is the 5300 mark after the prolonged decel by both drivers.

For anyone who hasn't moved on to Abu Dhabi, the reason it matters is it shows VER's braking pre-impact wasn't particularly heavy. Not really out of line with the entire decel, and certainly not unavoidable by a trailing driver leaving margin for error.

When an F1 car hammers the brakes it creates cliffs in telemetry speed data. Compare the following to the speed trace pre-impact on the Jeddah chart

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      12-07-2021, 02:31 PM   #899
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FormulaMMM View Post

For anyone who hasn't moved on to Abu Dhabi, the reason it matters is it shows VER's braking pre-impact wasn't particularly heavy. Not really out of line with the entire decel, and certainly not unavoidable by a trailing driver leaving margin for error.
also the Stewards specified a max braking of 2.4g.
But that doesn't say much. I mean, you can slow down from 101kph to 100kph with 10g, or a 100g if the car allows, but you'll still be only slowing down from 101 to 100kph, you're just doing it really fast.
If you cant dodge that, you're clearly too close to the other car

It is the amount of speed that you slow down abruptly, and that that significantly happened (a proper brake check is at least? 25kph? slowing down?) doesn't really show from both the data and the video footage.
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      12-07-2021, 02:33 PM   #900
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium View Post
You edited my post , that makes that your statement makes sense ...

Same way .Just like Mercedes is cheating with HAM's Rocket PU.

Well done mate !
I'm highlighting your over use of the term balls, and you referring to it like it's the most important trait a driver can have, and max is superior to Hamilton because he is "ballsy". Well it's not the case, being smart and calculated is more important/valuable than trying to push the envelope to be the fastest at all times. This is why max hasn't been able to wrap up the championship yet, because when you're always on edge mistakes happen - shunted in Silverstone and messed up this last qualifying.
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      12-07-2021, 02:38 PM   #901
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulo_f80m3 View Post
At least Max has the balls to fight Hamilton and Bottas while the rest of the grid (except Alonso) lets them go by without a fight. Looking forward to Sunday.
Because max is the only other one with the car capable to do so? Perez does too but he's really off the pace.

Everyone else gets blue flagged when theyre lapped, keep fighting that and you get a nice drive through.
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      12-07-2021, 04:09 PM   #902
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F87source View Post
I'm highlighting your over use of the term balls, and you referring to it like it's the most important trait a driver can have, and max is superior to Hamilton because he is "ballsy". Well it's not the case, being smart and calculated is more important/valuable than trying to push the envelope to be the fastest at all times. This is why max hasn't been able to wrap up the championship yet, because when you're always on edge mistakes happen - shunted in Silverstone and messed up this last qualifying.
It's easy for any driver to be calculating with rocket PU like in 44 car, it's exactly why Max has to drive at max always while take it easy Ham could rocket away but doesn't want to strain the mechanics too much and of course the tyres.
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